In my never-ending quest for lawyers to represent consumers and homeowners in distress

So far I have crashed and burned with trying to get a national or even regional group to meet regularly. The need is there but everyone is expecting me to do it. I don’t have enough time in the day to do what I’m doing, so I can help, I can promote, but I can’t make this happen. It’s like herding cats even though I have sought neither referral fees nor any remuneration of any kind. SOMEBODY out there has the skills to do this.

Here is my next proposal and I need help. I have too small a staff to do this on my own. I need someone who has a proven track record of organizing something like this. My thinking is that we either charge nothing and get grants from someone or charge as small a fee as possible for homeowners, consumers and lawyers and accountants to join up. (Accountants are missing a huge opportunity to act as forensic analysts and expert witnesses). It would be nice if someone stepped up to be the face of this effort besides me. I seek to accomplish ten goals:

  1. Do as the banks do — have large monthly telephone conferences in which we develop a consistent message that will consistently repeated in all courts around the country.
  2. Educate lawyers on strategies that are getting some traction or might get traction
  3. Receive education from lawyers who are getting it right
  4. Develop a list of lawyers in all states that are willing to at least take on some clients in foreclosure defense, rescission or other consumer remedies. Maybe we start a new website where the list of lawyers is given out.
  5. Highlight lawyers who are well -known or not well known — let them lead the round-table discussion.
  6. Combine resources for large actions in RICO, Constitutional challenges, class actions and mass joinder
  7. Combine resources for Amicus Briefs
  8. Develop a continually updated library of forms, complaints, answers, affirmative defenses, counterclaims, discovery, motions to compel, motions for summary judgment and memorandums of law. Maybe this could pay for itself.
  9. Develop an IT base that could make money where basic facts are input and the requested document is complied and sent to the lawyer or, where possible, to the homeowner.
  10. Potentially highlight policy makers, regulators and law enforcement to appear at our conferences to give information and answer questions.

Anyone interested? Anyone competent to help? email and attach or include some sort of resume and  statement of what plans you have for making this happen. We all know we need it. So how is this going to happen?

77 Responses

  1. Dear Neil and staff,

    I have tried in CT to organize a defense and am worn out but keep pushing for the points you raise. I have an NCIDQ interior design license but also have assisted in promotion and production of events and had approached your team to set up seminar meetings in my area. It is a daunting crisis that is very distasteful to judges and attorneys here. I will try again to compile some of my background information for your review. One friend suggested contacting the Yale law school to see if their manpower might assist while earning credits instead of valuable dollars.
    My comment is that there may be a grant to start an event planning company, But if you take grant money to establish you defense plan, while educating potential homeowners and attorneys, it could be used against the cause, as the Govt did give the bail out funds to the Banks….!

    Anyway, my daily court battles are and surrounded with insurance bad faith, the bank taking and continuing to hold insurance funds while forcing foreclosure, cooking books, and now CitiMortgage is attempting to re-assign to Bank of New York, after 1 1/2 years of me demanding ( without getting) the request for discovery and standing from a lawyer who has a conflict of interest. … is all ongoing, my funds are depleted , and I have to resume working in my career to attempt to keep bills paid while doing most of research and forwarding your information onto deaf ears

    My BEST SOLUTION TO REACH PEOPLE would be to go a documentary movie on my CASES, showing your Blog and how everyone acts ignorant to their damage causing delays and refusal to ACT on behalf of the homeowners, and demand national justice and show how even 401K pension finders are causing the crisis by pretending they have nothing to do with the fact that they are funding the MONSTER, allowing innocent people to loose their Net Worth.

    A Movie.

  2. Greg u just gotta laugh like someone said he’s a running comedy show! But he’s also a great deceiver lije the banksters these past 10 yrs. Anyone who goes along w that deception well u all know the rest.

  3. i’m sure glad that the word of g0d has been burned upon my chest by The Prophet Pope Bob Hurt – to let me know that i am just, “a kool-aid drinking bozo and myth monger who vomits stupid nonsense”… and… “write like an idiot on hallucinogens…”

    evidently i have sinned against the Church of Bob… i guess i should just die and go to hell now… anyone want to come with?

  4. anyone else want to have a kick at my head and insult me or are you all gonna let bob do all the work?

  5. OMG – brain dead

    my apologies to ALL for missing the hosting of tonite’s follow up Q&A Call

    with all the hubbub pertaining to the passing of my mother-in-law (my 4 kids’ grandma) 2 days ago and preparation – i completely lost a day of the week and lived today as if it were Wednesday…

    i will be back in sync next week, OK?

    please forgive –

    thank you

  6. The Story of Bob Hurt on Living Lies in 15 Steps…

    1) my way works, my way works, my way works!
    2) you guys are foolish to doubt that my way works!
    3) you guys are foolish to try any other way than my way!
    4) bob – please cite any or all cases in which your way and your direct service resulted in a winning outcome for a homeowner…
    5) i don’t have to – it is self evident – you drink kool-aid!
    6) c’mon bob – please – you are so darn passionate about your way, you must have been involved in at least one case where one customer you brought to the table to have Storm or others do the review came out a winner… tell us… show us, please…
    7) i’m sick and tired of you guys just ignoring me and my way, you dare doubt me – after all i am retired and have nothing to do except sit here and type 10,000 words a day into his blog to convince you
    8) hey bob – do you get a commission for people you bring to these mortgage analysts?
    9) that has nothing to do with this – i never charge a customer anything for my service…
    10) but do you deny that the mortgage analysts you refer people to pay you a commission?
    11) i’m retired and in good shape and don’t need any money…
    12) are you avoiding the question bob?
    13) i am so sick and tired of all you kool-aid drinkers and Garfield fans it makes me scream and call you names (oh BTW sorry)
    14) getting back to the question bob – would you please cite any or all cases in which your way and your direct service resulted in a winning outcome for a homeowner?
    15) F_ _K OFF!

    the end…
    repeat again and again…

  7. @bobhurt “NO ONE here has bothered buying a comprehensive mortgage examination from a competent professional, and that includes you.” Here is where you are wrong Bob – I had a forensic loan audit done by PaCE, LLC in Maryland. They discovered all kids of fraud, fabrications, from the inception of the loan and also fraud by the foreclosure mill of Shapiro & Burson. Great! Right? WRONG! Not one fucking judge up to the highest court in Maryland even looked at any of our evidence or considered one iota of it! NOT ONE! Three attorneys later with a depleted 401k we are living with my mother in law at the age of 60. We will both be working until we’re 80. I lost ancestral waterfront property to a greedy asshole who is now living my life in my house. You see with the help of the foreclosure mill he inserted himself right in the middle of my case. My last attorney told me that by inserting an innocent party (greedy asshole) that was one nail in the coffin.

  8. And the laughs keep coming!

  9. Bobhurt- you keep saying “banks”. The servicers initiate and follow through on the foreclosures. The banks have nothing to do with it. Everybody knows that-and if you call the trust dept recorded in the PSA, and give them your loan number , they tell you they are NOT the investor, and to call the servicer. And they put that in writing when asked to! Whadda buncha morons. No wonder they are all insolvent

  10. bob – i pray someday you have reason and balls to sue me and i can meet you face to face in court…

  11. “back in the day” – men all over America tore up of burned their draft cards in lawful civil protest against an unlawful police action in Viet Nam, which served no purpose in the way of defending the American people and only seemed to function as a meat grinder to reduce the surplus population, decrease joblessness and buoy the economy…


    Go naked into court without fear of BAR association retribution and prove you do not need to be in that drinking club in order to command justice!

    or do you think it is too late?

  12. here is what one strong consumer advocate lawyer that i respect told me in response to all the solutions we are trying (this includes Bob’s way, Neil’s way and all others in between)

    “The problem is Illinois judges do not/ have not applied these legal tenants; and now there are so many Illinois Appellate decisions to the contrary, the trial court judges hands are tied. The consequences of this sacrificing of the truth and long standing legal principles of real property law ON THE ALTER OF EXPEDIENCY will be borne for a generation at least. You are right; but still have no legal recourse in Illinois.”

  13. P.S.




  14. NEIL –


  15. Exactly Dwight which is why in CA you have the backwards logic that AFTER sale in unlawful detainer you can raise issue that note was void. But they are either corrupt or “don’t know ” that settlements and homeowner bill of rights require standing, valid transaction and old rules don’t apply. If tgey continue to ignore law we need to make our voices heard with every agency, official.

  16. Deb …
    1) The mortgage and note become void immediately – The rescission letter voids the mortgage and note once it is dropped in the mail. It’s like a court order, it is done by operation of law, without the borrower needing to have a court determine if it was valid or not. The simple act of mailing the letter automatically voids the mortgage and note of the subject loan. Disputed or not, it doesn’t matter. Whether the borrower had a valid reason or not, it doesn’t matter. The letter voids the deal. The lender has 20 days to comply or to file a law suit seeking to Vacate the rescission. If they ignore the rescission, they are waving their defenses and remedies.

    2) Standing. … The true creditor must step forward with proof of how they obtained ownership of the subject loan. Only the true owner of the debt can establish standing with proof of purchase receipts, wire transfers, cancelled checks, etc. have standing to challenge the TILA rescission, or to contest it, or argue about its merits ..Not the servicer who is trying to foreclose ..Not the servicer holding a note that they downloaded from a computer image ..not a servicer waving a copy of the void mortgage around in the air … No, only the creditor can argue against the rescission ..and he must take steps to Vacate it within the 20 days ..or he is barred for violating the statutory remedy..he does not get rewarded for ignoring the federal statute.

    3) The foreclosure dilemma – This is the gray area that needs some focus and attention. We all agree that a foreclosure should not be granted on a void mortgage and note due to the 2 points above.

    But, as in my case, the courts are still citing older case law, relying on areas that say “the court can change the sequence of tender, etc.”

    There was a paragraph I read from something one time that spoke about raising rescission in a foreclosure, that it can never be barred.

    This is the area that needs clarity and proper arguments to force the courts to understand that they have no say in the matter after so many days goes by. But the TILA statute never really spoke about the many “what its” … So who are these courts to think that they can legislate the law from their state court benches? If TILA doesn’t talk about what happens if the lender ignores ..then we should just accept it for the plain language that it does speak about.

    It does require the CREDITOR comply within 20 days

    So all of this speculation now, as judges and lenders scramble for a spin to put on this …to spin it back into the banks favor ..well we are seeing it now …they are throwing everything they can get their hands on .. They will attempt to create things that are not there in the statute..they will act like the judge can now litigate it years later in a foreclosure action ..which makes no sense at all.

    They are attempting to back-door the Jesinoski decision by snaking in under the cover of a foreclosure judge , who will deny the rescission as he did in my case.

    And this is where we are today … Jesinoski was a huge victory for us.

    But we now have the clean-up battles to wage …the defiant judges who are like Japanese soldiers hiding in caves on islands after WWII

    These judges will not accept their defeat with honor ..they will continue to shoot down borrowers from their benches.

    How do we put an end to these defiant, miserable judges disregarding the law? How do we force them to conform to law and order? They are out of control in their bias against homeowners. They still believe that they can adjudicate your TILA rescission and deny it.

  17. But hey they all even Trump are gonna get tough on Wall St. Right? Meanwhile Republicans want to finish the job and get rid of CFPB. And let’s not start another round of whining about CFPB and big bad gov’t like the banks spoon feed the masses. We have to quit playing their politics and court games. That’s what this proposal is about not just getting legal help.

  18. If you have been foreclosed on, you are an injured party and as one of you say move forward not backward and haven’t we all learned that there is no justice in the state court. The democrats and the banks are in bed together obuma and Jamie dimon. HARP and HAMP what a joke another deception on the American homeowner to make it look like something was being done to help the foreclosure crisis. I read another post. As an injured party take it to federal court, not appeals but to federal if there is to be any justice at all and get it overturned. I filed an affidavit in my case where I stated the FACTS of how I was bamboozled in the court room and I realize bamboozle is a bad choice of words, and I had representation at the time. I saw how both sides conspired to wrap up my case. I am not finished yet!

  19. Dwight
    Why did Jesinoski prevail

  20. I called on of the top foreclosure defense attorneys in northern NJ , right across from NYC .. I got him on the phone which is a rare thing to do when calling an office … he had just lost two big cases in the NJ Appellate Division that he claimed were very good cases that should have won .. but he lost both. He was dejected and complained to me that “something is not right, something is going on they have been told by government officials to just get rid of these foreclosure cases” ..

    He was very depressed and sounded defeated ….

    When I told him about my case, and that it could be the big win he’s been looking for … he didn’t sound inspired , he was defeated and beat up after two losses in the appellate court …

    I told him I rescinded under TILA and the Supreme Court just spoke to this issue in their Jesinoski decision ..

    “I’m not aware of that case” he said to me

  21. As for my causes of action – very clear. I discovered because they were sloppy.

  22. As for mortgage examinations and audits they have value, to me, i bought them all I’ve gone through to date around 80,000 usd on the litigation most in atty fees but court costs research and ofcourse the audits, im doing everything i can think of and its been an education, which costs however you get it. im not whining about it either im moving forward never backwards, always forwards, the past had value but its done, whats done, is done, i have moved forward.

  23. There you go again bob please go represent the banks you are biased your writing betrays you as far as im concerned
    If all things were true in your writing which they aren’t i would have totally taken it on the chin
    I know what im doing hence i declined to contact you, but in light of the aforesaid, im being fair giving you benefit of doubt as devils advocate because it has value, but trust you, pigs will fly first.

  24. de nial, is not a river in Egypt and the banks, attorneys, courts, govt are all involved and most just don’t care about what is right because they are all reeling in the dough. Why would they want to come clean and we all know how dirty money is. I am just one of the poster children in this corrupt mess. you can count me in. My experience and loss of sleep is priceless

  25. 😐

  26. Can i point something out
    Hands up who got meaningful discovery, hands up who got to any discovery. I rest my case.

  27. I think one of the biggest challenges is dealing with the fsct that lawyers are also brainwashed into thinking the borrower took on too much house and deserves what they got – asset stripped, not ofvwhat they had or in some cases didnt have but everything they ever hoped to have,
    Sure some were foolish in thinking that without a job they could buy a home no money down sure a manicurist cant afford a 300k new build, but the reliance we placed was misplaced and thats what lawyers need to get into – it crashed the economy for gods sake.

  28. Good word sc

  29. Deb… I suspect they all know they face treason and war crimes.
    I also suspect that fear has something to do with the ever climbing numbers in murder and suicide….and the run for the borders.

  30. Thing is for their own protection these people need to go to jail ( sorry my esotericness left me)

  31. Funny you should say that SC
    In my job I’ve seen addiction plenty, its an elevator and its going down – unless the person decides to get out. The greed of wallstreet and those who place more value on the color green and the illusion of power it gives them will self destruct, unless they get over their addiction the elevator is going down whether they are willing to realize it or not.

  32. The Constitution is being restored …..its going to be a tough transition unwinding what has been done….Despite all the ..GREED..Y…

  33. Just like any unhealthy addiction, you hit bottom before you rebuild.


    Would a University entertain this a class project of sorts?

    Mizzou maybe?


  35. May The G-d Almighty give Neil Garfield and Company strength and health to fight the forces of darkness

  36. Law is sacred and the universe knows
    Call me ” esoteric” because yes yes i am – and the definition is wrong- WE ALL ARE when we dig deep. I swear theres nothing insurmountable because god said so, yes he said it would be worth it and i believe that.

  37. of course SC theres a bigger picture what im saying is i for one cant sit on my bum and say ” its the way it is” that attitude is disrespectful of what those good guys in history did. The judges hold our future in their hands.

  38. We’ve been profiled & cloned.

  39. Reincarnation … Deb. Reincarnation.

  40. God didn’t say it was going to be easy… but he did provide us with the tools

    What is at stake here is… 👻ly.

  41. Yeah sc – and live An unlived life. ?

  42. dc. .. Yes it is.
    Once you know…you can not unknow.
    Its easier to know nothing.

  43. Bob said
    “The creditors find out how the borrowers hurt them and attack the injurious borrower (foreclosure results from the borrower breach of contract, of course, and that breach hurts the creditor). ”
    I think theres a lot more to that its not simple neither is beatung rule 12(b) 6 but your post is simple, the stuff behind what you say is a hell of a challenge.
    Consider the many law articles on twombly

  44. I have respect for anyone that tries to stand up for their home and right to possess, own and live peacefully and the rights we are supposed to have under the constitution like due process, life liberty and to defend our property in court, its not really their property if theres fraud and misrepresentstion of the loan and its terms and a hyoerinflated appraised value involved and where they concealed material facts from the court too. If theres only a few of us so be it consider how many have fought back, a tiny few because yes folks are ARE BRAINWASHED in their belief that it must be ok and that our government wouldn’t allow “that” and we must fear the bad guys and its too hard- its over right there. We are slaves to these bullies otherwise.

  45. 100% Ive followed this blog/site for years had them do the loan look up thing/combo thingy and have a lot of respect for the blog and most people willing to look at this from the real deal.

    Not dogging this site at all just talking,and its been hard when you think one thing and find out it is something very different.Its very depressing.

  46. And I would take it a step further DC in CA. We were denied the $300 mil that was to go to harm done to us. And the government agencies are ignoring law. But it’s not about destroying govt it’s about the banksters control of govt and the courts. But TILA. Ocwen etc are cracks in the too big too fail, deadbeat homeowner brain washing. At least Neil is trying to do something even if not perfect. At the least he’s pro homeowner and not parroting the banks bs.

  47. The lawyers in Cali IMO will take cases and act as though they are fighting the good fight but they too are only setting us up for the obvious and they will never ever never go against the judges,they arent going to put their career on the fast track to nowhere and thats that.

    Its no dif than the reason this was all allowed to go down from the get go and that its all coming from the top down,trickle down robbery of the entire nation by morons who think they are far superior than you and I.

    You cant possibly think that they are fooling the judges and the regulatory and its all slight of hand stuff?They are one the banks and our government and you can follow the money on that.

    It doesnt matter what you take to court or how its presented you see this by the number of landmark cases,maybe a judge here or there is tired of the lies and throws a homeowner a bone but rarely do you see this.
    I will say again the real estate industry all know these loans [the ones in default]are fair game and they have deals with the banks and local govs to steal it if they can and real estate lawyers first priority is the industry and it licensee’s not me or you,but they take the money and screw you.
    My last two lawyers didnt even come after what they said I owed,they knew they took their share from me and then you move on,the memo went out a long time ago,they call it “The after the scam,sham”and are very proud to take part.
    No body has to show accounting and if pressed it is all time barred anyways so move on and pay up.
    Americans have become wimps,pussies whatever you want to call it,its the same crap thats needed that was needed to create this nation,gotta be willing to fight and die for your rights and a blog is great but it wont get results,have to put the phones and devices aside and rally numbers big enough to get em scared,or more extreme things but folks arent up to it.
    Would rather die on my feet than live on my knees.[maybe]but you get it.

  48. … And i am grateful for this site.

  49. This is so darn huge and we all know it.

  50. You know we get to ” falling out” on here because the emotiinal aspect takes control, of course, why wouldnt it, but to move through the system i have learned to take the emotiin OUT and press law, point out what is WRONG DEAD WRONG UNder law and application of law under the rules that govern, thars my focus, not ” free” anything and im no deadbeat not in my vocabulary. ill accept the verdict once heard – with the complete set of facts – an ACCURATE record and the indispensible parties present in court.

  51. Deb,

    Not about you. Never been about you.

    About clarifying the system from day one. Get it or rot. Your choice.

    Done making money for LL on his “visitors:.

  52. Well Chritine
    You underestimate me sunshine. Dont apprive if your ” style” either. fwiw

  53. Deb,

    You seem to knows very little about class actions and what it takes to put them together. Not every winning case can create “a class”. Very few losing cases create “a class”.

    Patterns have to exist. Patterns were recognized and led to the infamous 2012 DOJ multi bank settlement, entered into and ratified by the courts… with no admission of any wrongdoing. The CFPB was created shortly thereafter, to handle the civil aspect of it and all further breaches, strictly on individual cases.

    The combination of both actually limited forward the ability for homeowners to create “a class”.

    It was intentional and well designed. That’s what happens when banks are proactive and own government and legislature and people keep being reactive and listen to bad advice.

  54. My tolerance for imbeciles is extremely low today, I used to have some immunity built up but obviously there is a new strain out there.

  55. The banksters created the defaults, kept borrower’s trapped, corrupted settlements. Deadbeats, sub prime, fog mirror urban myth part of the script. They destroyed the economy keep making money off us and you guys still fall for it. Amazing.

  56. Bob & Christine …… Neil’s going to send you to timeout again..
    Be sure to leave the whine and nuts here….
    Bring wine and peanuts.

    No Good Deed goes unpunished here ..

  57. The only deadbeats are the banksters who broke the law

    Fascist a holes

  58. Bob Hurt Christine find new jokes for your comedy show

    Your boring me

    Neil close down the comment section please

  59. For the love of god its nothing to do with deadbeat anything
    Anyne who could fog a mirror and sign their name

  60. There are deadbeat homeowners, gurus, lawyers, judges.

    So all banksters that never paid a dime and still threw out innocent victims are a thousand times worse and ur on a mission to help them get a way with or only about ur self interest unless ir completely oblivious to reality.

  61. Agree A Man like Dwight said damage done goes beyond legal approach.

  62. Bob H is dispassionate like banks are unfeeling about “deadbeat” homeowners.

  63. Dwight broke down the challenge and Deborah is in line with what Neil’s proposing imo. He’s looking through the lens of a lawyer but is reaching out. I think he needs to focus on policy side more. On the other hand we need to do our part where we can team up w this potential lawyer group. It should be unacceptable for any lawyer or judg to ignire supreme court for example.

  64. For starters You need an entrepreneur who will hire attorneys
    Close down the comment section of this blog too much negative energy if possible

    Great Attorney makes lousy entrepreneur
    Great entrepreneur makes lousy attorney
    Just an opinion


  65. I’m interested Neil. What does the position pay?

  66. Dwight
    This is why we need class actions on CONTINGENCY ofcourse the ” whats in it for me” has to be set aside, the attorneys have the knowledge, so its the self mentality that has to be put aside if we went forward with a whats in it for society and Future the answer is clear – if we sit idly by and i say this as if the opposition could hear me ( which i know they cant lol) but THERE WILL BE NOTHING left FOr ANYBODY.

  67. one massive class action of borrowers in each STATE against the mills et al… And this would be sorted, such a FIRM would GO down IN HISTORY and forever be remembered for helping save the USA in honor our predecessors and what they went through. Im a British citizen but lived here so long now i am more at home here than my former – i worked hard, i lost everything, i see what happened, and it must be done – please class action firm – DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

  68. I’m pretty much with Christine on this stuff.there’s very little money to be made on the defense side, so lawyers aren’t going to waste their time trying to learn this stuff only to have to go up against big banks with virtually unlimited resources. you’re not going to find very many recorded wins, because when the banks sense that they’re going to lose, they make an attractive settlement offer…sealed. as for bob hurt’s stuff, well, there are statutes of limitations, and most every one he would like you to sue has already gone out of biz. but he has value to add here in that he can dissect this stuff dispassionately because he’s not being foreclosed on himself. but on the other hand, the cases that he likes to rely on, such as quicken loans, seem to me to be greatly different than what most people here are confronted with. in quicken, they screwed this old lady from the get go. most folks here are complaining about getting screwed during their foreclosure litigation.
    big difference in terms of compensatory and punitive damage awards.

    just my two cents.

  69. Shadowcat,

    In your dreams! I’d rather be kicked out and come back to tell all about it and why each time.


    “So where are these great lawyers sharing their information like Neil has?”

    Well… Neil shares alright. Information? Nope. Editorializing without demonstrating is not information. It’s called “wishful thinking”. Does Neil do anything for free? Hell no!. Do attorneys do things for free and really educate? The ones I know do in every state. They tend to get… kicked out from here! I wonder why…

    Unfortunately, LL curtails postings of really helpful links. And I don’t have time to go state by state and hold everyone’s hand. The information is definitely out there. Look for it. Or keep posting and wasting your life.

  70. The problem that exists is that there are 3 seperate categories of foreclosure cases. The categories are as follows ….

    1) The borrower who Bob, Christine and co. all refer to, which is the group of borrowers who have proof of accounting errors, appraisals, breaches, etc., etc. … which are identified through forensic audit and examination of the mortgage contract, from origination through the alleged default and all payments and charges made in between. This group represents the minority of cases in the system, but probably do account for the majority of wins and settlements. Very few of the overall numbers of borrowers have the money or desire to lay out around 5 thousand dollars to have their mortgages examined. The ones who do, and have prevailed, are the reason the proponents of this are so passionate about this strategy being the “best and only way” to attack.

    2) The un-informed borrowers who know nothing about what is going on. All they know is that they missed payments and the bank or servicer they send payments to is foreclosing. They react in the normal way that millions of others have reacted, by trusting that the bank “doesn’t really want their home, that they instead will want to modify and allow them to stay and make lower monthly payments” …this group gets raked over the coals, abused and toyed with while the bank dual-tracks towards the inevitable foreclosure. This group admits they defaulted, this group feeds the most business to the “foreclosure defense/bankruptcy field of lawyers” out there who make a living off these easy, lay-down cases in which the borrower eventually loses the house. The legal community enjoy this type of “normal” client because it doesn’t require intense litigation or trials, it is simply a repetitive routine of filing answers and taking the normal legal defenses and arguments that are responsible for volumes and stacks of bad caselaw. Since 2008 these cases have contributed to the current travesty that exists today. The courts have become accustomed to the presumptions and rely on the fabricated documents of hundreds of thousands of wrongful foreclosures that create the caselaw they cite today. The legal community who have made their living off this make-believe litigation have no desire to upset the apple cart …they don’t want to bite the hand of the judge who feeds them. They have close relationships with these judges, secretaries, clerks ..they attend gatherings, fundraisers and parties together ..they feel they have “a reputation to protect”. These lawyers are very reluctant to partake in true foreclosure defense, they fear the ridicule and scorn that might come from it. They fear making the judge angry due to filing motions and appeals that point out his errors, abuse of discretion, his arbitrary, capricious and unreasonable decisions. They just want to make a living and be one of the crowd , treated nicely by their peers and not looked at as a crazy lunatic fighting for the Free House . This group represents the vast majority in the system, the struggling families who know no better, they go to an attorney, they pay the money, the answer he prepares admits a default …the song and dance gets played out in court like a finely orchestrated Broadway musical, complete with all of the drama so as to make the husband and father think his lawyer is trying his best to convince the judge to “help save their home” ..but in the end..the sadness and horror of it all …I’m sorry, we lost the case. There is nothing to appeal …but you do owe me a balance of 500 dollars for the extra copies my office made for your records..Good Luck to you and your family .. The Bank had the Note ..and we’ll, you did miss your payments ..but we tried least you went down swinging”.

    3) The third group is represented by us, the borrowers who understand that the Ponzi scheme has been exposed, identified by investigations of the department of justice and states attorneys General offices has been written about and discussed on this blog primarily is real, it is criminal and it is being allowed to continue for the most part. We do not know all of the behind the scenes deals and instructions that have been made by the powers that be, but it is disturbingly evident that the judiciary is in lock-step with each other to try their best to prevent this truth from prevailing in any foreclosure defense strategies in court. They, the judges, refuse to accept this reality that the banks who file these foreclosure complaints lack standing. These banks are not the real party in interest. The subject loans have not been purchased and transferred in a valid, legal way along the hidden and broken chains. The paperwork and documents they file in court prove nothing. They are fabricated to appease the judge and to conform to all of the bad caselaw that the courts have created by abusing group #2 above. So when we truthers walk into court rattling the judges cage and disturbing his peaceful foreclosure mill courtroom …we are scorned and hated. We expose the rotten game being played out in court for what it is, pure injustice ..a travesty and disgrace to our nation and citizens …we expose the judge and shock his senses when we reveal the truth, that he is not a just judge, that he is allowing parties to steal the homes of American families ..that he is perpetuating and facilitating the biggest crime ever to take place in the history of our nation ..when we raise these arguments and speak the truth in court …it gets personal, very personal ..because what we are arguing in essence, is that they are all part of it ..all of those who allow this injustice and travesty to continue, they are ashamed and their egos are crushed as they realize that these borrowers are in essence pointing out that the whole rotten system is corrupt ..from the filthy dirty banks the weak spineless lawyers who play along …to the egotistical judge who creates and cites the bad case law …to the Appellate court judges who can’t stomach a borrower getting the “Free House” … The entire judiciary is trying to stand together on this …because they see the borrowers as deadbeats who missed their mortgage payments, and they don’t deserve the house. So the judiciary would rather continue to cite the bad case law …continue to push back against us in a fight to the death over this fraud. They do not have it in their hearts to allow justice to prevail. The answer to all of this is in the battlelines that are being drawn everyday …our numbers are growing …we take huge numbers of casulties ..we get destroyed in most courts , not because of the merit of our arguments, but due to the reluctance of the courts to seek the truth and allow justice to prevail. This is a war ..we need to grow our numbers ..we need to bring it to the attention of the national media in order to publicly shame the judges, to shed light on the dirty little secret of what travesties occur in these courtrooms everyday .. Its an injustice, a denial of due process, a denial of the Equal Protection clause, the stealing of homes from American families …it is a national disgrace. Here in NJ, I was forced to hire a paralegal to help me write a Motion correctly … I could not find one competent or willing lawyer to argue any of these truths talked about on this blog. The legal community has a real serious problem. Maybe we need to bring this problem to the attention of the Law Universities so that they might get involved in this travesty and try to help correct it. Maybe we need to set out on a mission to plead for help from the law students and professors at these universities to try and ask them to get involved …tens of thousands of law students studying this problem and writing legal arguments on how the borrowers should prevail under a just system of law when it is applied correctly, with honor and integrity.

  71. So where are these great lawyers sharing their information like Neil has? Or how about someone like Szymoniak who pops up once a year? There is no blueprint where u can just copy motions. The best part of the proposal is to create a united effort and hit on policy as well as court. The answer is to push TILA and avoid court trap as much as possible. This can be done to address fraud and in group efforts. Mains could be the blueprint.

  72. Christine .. Does this mean your applying for the job?
    Wouldn’t that be a Hoot?

    Behave KC. .. LOL!

  73. Scott,

    It gets me kicked out regularly but I won’t keep quiet. Count the winners on this blog. Whiners aplenty. Winners?

    And even though I do get kicked out for speaking up in unfavorable terms to LL, I still get regularly reinstated after a while…

    What does that tell me? Bad publicity is better than none. ‘Cuz LL makes money by the number of “visitors” (visits) to his site. In addition to making money by selling “forms, complaints, answers, affirmative defenses, counterclaims, discovery, motions to compel, motions for summary judgment and memorandums of law. Maybe this could pay for itself.”

    Garfield gets full retirement and makes serious money on the side, running his website, peddling his stuff and using people. For now 6 years, I have consistently asked him for ONE case he ever tried and… won! Still waiting.

    I attend seminars all the time. Given by attorneys who win. The dedicated ones give them for free and really want to empower their clients into understanding the system, learning to organize their paperwork, draft timelines and participating in their own case. You ain’t gonna find that here.

    LL is a cult of what Paul Craig Roberts calls dumbshits.

  74. If you find a case that is similar to yours and that case won. You can go to the clerk of courts and ask to review the case files. You can even have all the filings copied. That way you have complaint, the pleadings, arguments and motions all for a few dollars for copying fees.

  75. Christine, you have some valid points.

  76. “Educate lawyers on strategies that are getting some traction or might get traction.”

    “Highlight lawyers who are well -known or not well known — let them lead the round-table discussion.”

    “Develop a continually updated library of forms, complaints, answers, affirmative defenses, counterclaims, discovery, motions to compel, motions for summary judgment and memorandums of law. Maybe this could pay for itself.”

    A few problems here with the approach:

    1) committed lawyers who need “educating” on strategies getting some traction or that MIGHT get traction… don’t go to LL to get their education. Federal and state court records speak for themselves, they are all public records and successful attorneys conduct their own seminars and conferences. Lawyers smart enough to know they need “training” attend seminars from winners with proven record. Lacking here…;

    2) well-known and not so well-known lawyers who get quantifiable results don’t go to LL for inspiration and have no time to rescue or salvage bad cases damaged by LL. Most of them tried LL theories, got burnt and never tried it again;

    3) the information is there, available to everyone… pretty much for free. Why would lawyers pay for forms and pleadings when all they have to do is zero in on… winning cases?

    Lawyers sincerely interested in helping their clients don’t use LL. They see winning cases, they pick up the phone and call the attorneys of record and they… deal among themselves directly, without any intermediary having won NO CASE in his name. They don’t need LL. Ask mine… He’s vocal about it!

    On the other hand, if the idea is to pluck a few more pro se by creating the illusion of a network of lawyers, an extensive library that means jack to them and forms you know for a fact they will misuse because they don’t get the system, they don’t get the issues and they hardly understand what they read.

  77. Neil,

    Us homeowners have been saying the same thing for years.  The lawyers for what ever reason do not want to represent us when we present the facts to them.  They have the same bias.  Which is if what you say is true you are going to get a free house.  Since they are making their house payments and not currently in trouble they don’t take us seriously and refuse to represent us even when we provide the evidence. Regarding recruiting attorneys for the cause.  I would start with foreclosure cases that were settled outside of court.  Look up the attourneys’ on record and contact them.  They obviously did something right and have the balls to stand up to the banks..  I don’t have access to these cases.  If I did I would help out. I have done some research on these trust or should I say alleged trust.  I say alleged because the trust were never registered.  I have letters from the Delaware State division of Banking and their Secretary of States’ office that state that various trusts have never been registered in the State of Delaware.  But these same trusts that are registered with the SEC state they legally registered in the state of Delaware.  When I notified the SEC that these trust were in fact not registered in the State of Delaware the SEC encouraged me to file a whistle blowers complaint.  The SEC even emailed the me the form to file the complaint.  But I have been unable to find an attorney that is willing to take this on.  We are talking millions of dollars for just one trust.  There are thousands of trust and they are all set up the same way.   Millions of dollars TIMES Thousands of Trusts.  You add it up.  It would be a nice slush fund to fight the banks.

    I was able to speak to one attorney that represented some investors that won their case or should I say they settled outside of court.  This attorney said I was correct on every point I brought up.  The notes were never funded, the trust do not own the notes, the notes were never securitized.  The notes are actually the personal property of the creator of the notes which are the borrowers.  That is unless the banks bought the notes.   In which case if the bought the notes than there is not loan.  No loan no mortgage, no foreclosure.  But for the sake of argument if we go under the pretense that the loans were actually made on the up and up.  The borrower which is the creator and owner of the note gives the note to the lender as collateral and the mortgage is the security for the note.  The lender keeps the note in safe keeping to prove the borrowers obligation to the lender.  Once the borrower honors the terms of their note in the perfect world the lender is required to give the borrower their note back and file a satisfaction of mortgage. Since the lender never owns the note they cannot securitze the note without the borrowers written permission.  Now that the lenders insured the notes and placed credit default swaps against the instruments that they did not own.  Any pay outs from these policies belong to the owner of the notes which is the creator of the notes which is the borrowers not the banks.  This lawyer agreed with all of this but his firm only represents large clients not individual homeowners. Neil, do you know of any attorneys that would take on this type of case.  Remember you only need prove that one note does not meet the Trust’s PSA parameters and the Trust loses their tax exempt status.  I can prove that ever note in the alleged Trust does not meet the PSA guidelines.  It is also relatively easy to track down all the homeowners in these trust.  The PSA gives you this information if you know where to look. Another way to attack the banks is to follow wall streets example.  Start a union/organization and charge monthly dues for lobbyist so they can champion our cause in Washington.  I am currently in the process of starting a non profit organization.  We could easily set this well worthy cause up as a non profit organization to. Neil, a lot of people on your blog have different views on how to skin the perverbial cat.  Most of their views are correct.  But they have blinders on and they think everyone elses way view is incorrect.  We just need to set up a sit down with some of these posters and get everyone on the same page.  Most of them are fighting for the same desired results we just need to get them all on the same page.  Take the strenghts in their arguments and combine them and strengthen the week points of each others arguments instead of cutting each other down.  This is exactly what the banks want.  Divide and conquer. Just my 2 cents worth.  If you think i have something to contribute or can be of help you can call me. From the outside looking in.Scot Krueger920-318-1923 From: Livinglies’s Weblog To: Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2015 4:24 PM Subject: [New post] In my never-ending quest for lawyers to represent consumers and homeowners in distress #yiv7482916400 a:hover {color:red;}#yiv7482916400 a {text-decoration:none;color:#0088cc;}#yiv7482916400 a.yiv7482916400primaryactionlink:link, #yiv7482916400 a.yiv7482916400primaryactionlink:visited {background-color:#2585B2;color:#fff;}#yiv7482916400 a.yiv7482916400primaryactionlink:hover, #yiv7482916400 a.yiv7482916400primaryactionlink:active {background-color:#11729E;color:#fff;}#yiv7482916400 | Neil Garfield posted: “So far I have crashed and burned with trying to get a national or even regional group to meet regularly. The need is there but everyone is expecting me to do it. I don’t have enough time in the day to do what I’m doing, so I can help, I can promote, but I” | |

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