Just Because You Are Not In Foreclosure Doesn’t Mean You Are not in Trouble

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As is usually the case in American politics, homeowners have been divided into groups and then pit against each other. There are plenty of people who have not stopped paying on their mortgage, but they are still in trouble for the same reasons that others are in foreclosure. It is the commonality of interests of homeowners that is preventing them from presenting a single unified voice demanding reform. And it is the persistent view that opposing the current wave of foreclosures is in some way attacking the basic myth of personal responsibility as an American credo.

The entire country was victimized by the Banks in their mortgage madness and there is no mileage in blaming borrowers for bad mortgages designed by experts who knew exactly what they were doing. The whole scheme depended upon false inflated land values and bank control over the appraisers, underwriting procedures and mortgages terms. In a thirty year period the types of loans available mushroomed from 4-5 to more than 400 different variations of loan templates, one of which could be understood by even Alan Greenspan, former head of the Federal Reserve (by his own admission).

The obvious correction back to true land values has left homeowners without any equity after they were hounded by hard-sell sales pitches to “use” the equity in their homes to fund other things. Besides the obvious wrong foundation of this pitch, it was based upon equity that did not exist but people were lured into the trap because the appraisal came in at $20,000 more than the amount on the contract, and the “bank” approved it. what the borrower did not know was that the appraiser was told the number that was needed, and it was made abundantly clear that they would never see any business if they didn’t tow the line and appraise the property at the figure given to them by the mortgage originators.

Now there are millions of homeowners are so far underwater that they will most likely never get out from under the crushing debt that was manufactured by mortgage originators who had no risk in the deal because they were using their own money to fund the loan. The reliance of the borrowers on these “lenders” was misplaced. They were pretender lenders and their approval of the dal was not a sign that experts had looked at he loan and deemed it a viable transaction, it was simply a ruse in which the mortgage originator was playing part and getting paid for it.

Today, after nearly 100 million mortgage transactions, and a nearly complete absence of proper paperwork, it is now apparent that mortgages were refinanced, houses were sold, and new homes were bought using this faulty paperwork, leaving a trail of corrupted title that cannot be corrected except on a case by case basis. The modification applications in which the applicant signs away rights to contest the paperwork doesn’t cure title although it might protect the bank from damage claims.

The message is clear. With few exceptions, most transactions over the past 10+ years do not present clear title, marketable title or even curable title. Anyone who has done a transaction during that period will find out in the years to come that the deal they did is not over and they may well find themselves in court without understanding of why they are there. When it comes time to move on, sell the house and buy another, the whole problem starts over again even if you never missed payment and never went through foreclosure. And if you bought a foreclosed home, there is good chance that the title is fatally defective. Check with your lawyer before you sign anything because you might be signing onto liability you never guessed existed.

76 Responses

  1. […] Just Because You Are Not In Foreclosure Doesn’t Mean You Are not in Trouble Posted on September 21, 2011 by Neil Garfield […]

  2. Neil,
    There is a typo(?) in the second paragraph above, ie: “templates, one of”, should be “templates, none of”, imho.

  3. INTERESTING TRANSCRIPT–MISSING NOTARY JOURNAL ENTRIES

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/69423026/RED-HERRINGS-MOLES-A-FEISTY-ORAL-ARGUMENT-BY-HOMEOWNER-TRANSCRIPT

  4. my loan was with countrywide but of course its now with boa I have been trying to get a modification from them starting in nov of 2009 and made monthly payments that whole time, they now say I qualify for the modification but my loan will go up $15000.00, intrest fees etc. this doesnt seem right to me. also the assignment of the loan from countrywide to boa was not done untill march 2010 well after the merger is there something there i can use thanks.

  5. Correction — HARP for mandated GSE refinance –not HAMP.

  6. ian

    Yes. Thanks Ian.

    Countrywide loans sold to GSEs subject of Repurchase Agreement between BofA and Fannie/Freddie. So these were loans that were fabricated to appear as conforming — but were not. (And, not fabricated by homeowners).

    But, were not conforming loans obligated to be sold to GSEs?? If not, would that not prejudice homeowners whose actual conforming loans wound up elsewhere — since only Freddie/Fannie loans qualify to be refinanced by HAMP??

    Know GSEs purchased “MBS” from the likes of Goldman, Lehman, Bear Stearns, Merrill Lynch, etc —– but, appears these are not loans qualified to be refinanced by GSEs via HAMP. Or are they??? And, if so — why have so many “trust” loan refinances been denied???

    So — either not in the trusts of the likes of — or never went to GSEs — either directly or via MBS. Where did these “conforming loans” go??? Or were they never conforming to begin with — because of the fabricated default???

    Conforming/Non-conforming — who determined — and how is a refinance by HAMP — now determined?? HAMP refinance only for GSE loans.

    Part of the credit crisis is — no refinances. Is HAMP a farce? (goes without saying) — – or is that loan was diverted from GSE control?? Both — I am sure. .

  7. ANONYMOUS- good question about conforming loans, especially from 2001-2006, not being sold to Fannie/Freddie. I would believe that as the fraud escalated, the invesment banks (Goldman, Lehman, Bear Stearns, Merrill Lynch, etc) which stood the most to gain from the sale of MBS, RMBS, needed a larger number of conforming full doc loans in each pool, in the top several tranches, in order to give a bit of respectability to each offering. So they paid the originators more than would be gained from a sale to Fannie/Freddie, who were running their own ‘cook the books’ fraud with the implicit guarantee of the US Govt., which of course, is us. From a common sense or even a logical point of view, if Countrywide, with BOA as warehouse lender, originated primarily subprime, no doc loans with no underwriting, where on earth would they get a fully conforming full doc loan to stack the upper tranches of each pool? People who took out fully conforming loans were not Countrywide’s customer base. They had people cold calling the ghettos, looking for someone, anyone who was breathing, had a SS# or could steal one, and who could make some type of mark on a ‘promissory note’. By the time it was ending, alot of mortgage brokers were advertising on books of matches. Quite a distinguished clientele. At one point, the FBI financial crimes unit stated that mortgages were taken out over 300,000 with stolen SS #s, and 10,000 mortgages taken out in the names of dead people.

  8. ian,

    Yes — many others involved. Yes — needed each other. Until maybe now — now going after each other. Amazing.

    Question for you Ian — that maybe you can answer. Why would a “bank” not sell a conforming loan to Freddie or Fannie — when it was their practice to do so??? Can you or anyone else answer this???

    As to the changed loan numbers — agree — need to start with Mortgage Schedules — what loan numbers are contained??? Is there any adjustment to the Schedule to account for a changed loan number??? If not, where were payments applied??? Who accounted for the changed loan number payments to the IRS??? That is — the old loan number had to not have been charged off – in order for applied payments. Not the case — with a changed “loan” number. In fact, no tracing available. .

    Thanks, Ian.

  9. ANONYMOUS- as you well know, it is not only Radian, but also PMI, MGIC, AMBAC, MBIA, in other words, a number of monoline insurors who have taken devastating hits. But, as they are intrinsic to the entire fraud, I am sure that there has been or is currently collusion (illegal) on an ongoing basis. They all need each other, I would imagine that they have an agreement among themselves, servicers, originators, GSEs, banks, to limit actual losses through fraudulent MODS, defaults not reported as such, etc.
    As far as loan numbers changing, a lengthy post with examples would serve to let LL readers see a little further into the rotting carcass the failed securitizations. Thanks for taking the time to comment.

  10. Hi Ian,

    Second Carie — absolutely.

    Problem is courts are way behind the eight ball on “debt collection” — largely due to fraud upon the court – and concealment covered by deregulation. Courts do not even know that “derivatives” are not securities — in fact, rarely even know what a derivative is.

    Now question is — were “insurers” like Radian — aware of the game — that is, held many derivatives themselves??? And, what were the cures??? A loan mod-??- or foreclosure/short sale?? HAMP “mod” is only available for GSE loans. Private mods — not good statistics as to mods. Radian — mostly private “credit” enhancement — so what cures do they boast of?? Are they boasting of “collection rights” mods??? Unsecured — hope not.

    As to loan numbers — you are, again, absolutely correct. One of the first things done in “debt collection” — is to change the “loan” number.. Why?? the prior loan has been charged-off — and very difficult – tax wise — to reverse non-accrual on charged off debt. Once loan charged-off — impossible to pay on that loan without extreme accounting reversal. In practice, never done. Prior loan number — gone.

  11. Ian—absolutely…and homeowners are still in the dark…

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  13. ANONYMOUS- in regards to default debt, here is some info- MBS insuror Radian Guaranty stated that in July there were 48,758 mortgage defaults insured by the industry. Additionally, there were 35,905 “cures”. As to the defaults, it would be nice to know the borrowers’ names and loan numbers of the insured mortgages which were paid by insurance coverage. As the UCC states “….any payment made on the obligation diminishes the balance due and owing on that obligation, even if such payment was made by a stranger to the transaction”. So if an insured 250k mortgage defaults, the insurors pays, say, 60%, or 150k, the balance, unsecured default debt, is pawned off to a debt collection firm for say, 3%, or 3k, and they go about hounding the homeowner for the full 250k. And the default is linked to technical definitions within the trust docs, the homeowner never knows that he/she is in default and that collection rights have been sold. Not recorded anywhere. As far as the 35,905 “cures”, these are probably HAMP mods, made by servicers in order to cash in on govt. payments for same, milk it out, and then foreclose anyway. The cures are just an illusion or accounting chicanery so that these entities can stay afloat awhile longer.

  14. I cant believe we are still debating the alleged fraud.

  15. Wells Fargo accused of forging loan documents

    BY DOUG MCMURDO
    LAS VEGAS REVIEW-JOURNAL
    Posted: Sep. 22, 2011 | 2:02 a.m.
    A Las Vegas attorney who represents people facing foreclosure has accused Wells Fargo of forging loan documents. The allegation is the latest sign that efforts to hold mortgage lenders accountable are escalating in Nevada.

    In court papers filed this month in Clark County District Court, attorney Dave Crosby alleged bank employees committed forgery and fraud in making a $350,000 loan to a father of four who was unemployed at the time.

    “They forged signatures, they backdated documents,” Crosby said. “We’ve got them cold.”

    Crosby said the bank has presented two deeds of trust for the same property. One bears the signature of Olivia A. Todd, who on Jan. 27, 2010, was identified as an assistant secretary with MERS, Inc., a mortgage servicer from the Phoenix area and a co-defendant in the lawsuit.

    But on Feb. 16, 2010, Todd’s signature appears on a second deed of trust, where she is identified as the firm’s president. Both assignments were notarized as authentic, Crosby said in court papers.

    Crosby made his allegations in a request to have a judge review three failed mediations between him and his clients, Ryan and Mical Henderson of Las Vegas, and lawyers with Wells Fargo, formerly Wells Fargo Home Mortgage.

    Attempts to contact bank attorney Kevin Soderstrom were unsuccessful. Calls to Wells Fargo also went unreturned.

    Nevada Foreclosure Mediation rules allow for a judicial review of failed mediations. In Clark County, District Judge Donald Mosley hears all such reviews.

    The Legislature created the Foreclosure Mediation Program in 2009 to help thousands of troubled homeowners in the state, considered ground zero of the U.S. housing crisis, where tens of thousands of homes have been abandoned or foreclosed and a staggering 80 percent of homeowners owe significantly more than their homes are worth.

    But banks and title insurance companies have not always been able to prove they own the mortgage and have the right to foreclose.

    The Henderson case is the latest shot across the bow of mortgage lenders. The Nevada Supreme Court has issued rulings favoring homeowners in several recent cases on appeal. Nevada Attorney General Catherine Cortez Masto is expected to file criminal charges against bank and title company employees, as well as notary publics, over allegations of robo signing.

    The term applies to a practice of signing affidavits attesting that bank officials have reviewed documents and found them proper even without making any review.

    When the robo-signing scandal erupted last October in Florida, bank employees admitted to signing 10,000 documents a month without knowing whether they are legitimate.

    Masto’s office declined comment on any plans for criminal action against robo-signers. She has taken an aggressive approach to holding banks accountable, and the Legislature earlier this year enacted new laws regarding robo signing.

    Crosby said he suspects robo-signing is widespread in Nevada. One of his cases was the subject of an appeal filed with the state’s high court, and he used the lender’s own words against it.

    Supreme Court justices found in favor of Crosby’s client, Moises Leyva, ruling unanimously that lenders have an absolute duty to strictly follow foreclosure mediation rules exactly as written.

    More important, the high court ensured lenders couldn’t simply provide a sworn statement, often from their own employees, that they were the lender even when they failed to provide a verified copy of the deed of trust.

    “They admitted how disorganized they were, that they lost paperwork,” Crosby said.

    In court papers, Crosby accused Wells Fargo of continuing to play outside the lines. He alleged that a document the bank produced during mediation was backdated and bore a style of notary stamp that didn’t exist at the time it was signed. The document is included in the court file.

    He also alleged that two documents bore the name of a bank employee and “are notarized by the same notary, (but) both signatures do not belong to the same person.”

    Crosby wants Mosley to rule that Wells Fargo acted in bad faith, to award sanctions for the “obvious forged, backdated and falsified documents” and to award cash sanctions.

    Crosby will ask Mosley to fine Wells Fargo an amount equal to the difference between the loan and the home’s current value.

    The Supreme Court in its recent decision has made it clear to judges that such sanctions are appropriate when lenders are found to have acted in bad faith. A hearing has been scheduled for Oct. 6.

    Review-Journal writer Chris Sieroty contributed to this report. Contact Doug McMurdo at dmcmurdo@reviewjournal.com or 224-5512.

  16. HMan

    Courts have held mortgage servicer is a debt collector if it acquired “loan” while in default. This would be the case for subprime “refinances” – albeit – false default.

    Agree, of course, that not all loans were/are subprime. However, subprime was the catalyst for the financial crisis — by which its fraud caused “shock” to the system, eventually the economy, and which caused a spill-over of foreclosures. .

    Even if loan was not a subprime — at some point, servicer ceases making advance payments and loan is removed from trust by which servicer claims to be servicing for. At this point, servicer begins “collection” for another entity via derivatives/contracts. Thus, current creditor obligated to divulge itself byTILA Amendment — since a “sale” of collection rights has occurred. Current creditor also subject to FDCPA — but, you have to know who that current creditor is — in order to apply the FDCPA.

    In the past, GSEs easily disposed of non-performing “loans” — also by “credit enhancement” – whether a fabricated default or not. Today, 95% of all NEW mortgages are by GSEs. Much more difficult, today, to dispose of due to inability to perform insurance contracts — nevertheless, as conservator, that is the government’s goal — just as it is government’s goal by Maiden Lane.

    Distressed debt buyers have been heralded since the days of Alan Greenspan — when he praised their function after 9/11. And, this is why government is reluctant to help homeowners. Doing so would mean that “contracts” privy to secrecy by deregulation — would have to be exposed — and, would subject participating parties to litigation – including prior fraud upon courts. .

    Much could have been avoided had the government come in and “bailed out” homeowner victims – not the banks — at the financial crisis onset. As it now stands, many of those banks are in big trouble anyway — and the economy is not improving. Moody’s just downgraded the “too big to fail” banks. Cover-up at financial crisis onset — just prolonged the inevitable.

    Eventually, government will have to address the fraud — and uphold the law as to current creditor/distressed debt buyer — because situation is not getting any better. At that point, BK courts will be filled — as unsecured debt will prevail.

    Again, ask yourself, why did Congress vote down BK reform twice?? Because it would have just made BK too easy for homeowner victims.
    As it stands, however, do not need reform — just need courts to uphold consumer protection and disclosure of current creditor.

  17. That was a typo, Neil meant to write “weren’t” not “were”. The point everyone is overlooking is the fact that the loans were made in fraud and are unenforeceable! Get the bank to send you copies of your Note…they always send copies, cuz the original was shredded. Look for a stamped endorsement, saying “pay to____without recourse” and you have all the evidence you need to prove that your Note (Which is a negotiable instrument like a check) was monitized. They deposited it, and used it to lend more money as a transaction based on fractional reserve banking. Ask for the original “wet ink” note–get a copy. They don’t want you to know how much they made off of your signature. If you use Administrative Process to sqeeze documents out of them, they may dismiss your foreclosure, rather than let the cat out of the bank vault. Challenge everything and fight the bastards.

  18. Carie,

    That comment is very telling.

  19. from comment section of link I just posted–(further proof that all “they” want to do is foreclose—even if they have to manipulate everything to do it):

    Bill
    6:12pm on Wednesday, September 21, 2011

    “As a Broker, I worked a B of A short sale through over 9 months. They lost the entire file twice, and I rebuilt it from scratch. They came back with a counter offer and the first Buyer walked. Then an all cash Buyer made an offer at exactly the price and terms B of A stated in their counter to the first Buyer, and asked to close in under 30 days. B of A lost the letter the Seller had sent authorizing me to negotiate on their behalf, which they had approved twice in the preceding 9 months. They wouldn’t even talk to me for a week and a half while they were reviewing the same letter. A week before the sale to the new Buyer was to close, B of A foreclosed on the property. They then re-listed the property as a foreclosure for $50,000.00 less than the cash offer. Go figure.”

  20. Wow, currently in Fed Court. Filed Lis Pend in June when we got started. MERS does an Assignment of DOT last week and moves it to the Pretender Trustee. Fraud document, signed on same day be entities on the opposite side of the country, MERS bogus address, and they assign both the DOT and Note.

    Pretender Servicer is trying to judicialy notice the original note with no endorsements from the out of business originator as evidence to the court. If the Judge rubber stamps this one for the bank, I will have lost all faith in the courts and our country.

  21. Carie,

    Try ignoring tnharry and maybe he/she will go away. It is very clear that this person is here to disrupt and divide–and to agitate those who are already stressed. Think about it, anyone who says a higher number of subprime mortgages would make them prime (“…by definition…”) just might have a screw loose, and for sure is not qualified to give competent advice about mortgages. But I’ll give tnharry some credit, he/she does a great (and RUDE) job of trying to discredit the OWNER of this site. That in itself tells me all I need to know.

    Maybe tnharry will find a job soon.

  22. HMan—what is a DVR? Other than something that records your favorite show…

  23. Hello Everyone,

    I’ve read that the fdcpa doesn’t apply to Loan Servicers. However I don’t believe everything I read.

    Anyway, I’m preparing a Ammended DVR to Aurora Bank. f/k/a Aurora Loan Servicing. I received a letter from Aurora in June or July stating that the loan was being “transfered to our parent company, Aurora Bank”. I thought under FDCPA it was illegal to transfer a loan in default? It also violates the PSA agreement.

    The loan during this time was already in default. I do not however want ot admit this because it may backfire. Also, any ideas if this would apply being the loan is staying within the company? The loan #’s are staying the same. This would not only apply to me but anyone who has Aurora. All of the loans we’re switched to Aurora Bank as the new servicer.

    Also, any ideas how I could word this in my DVR. Your thoughts are much appreciated!

    Thank you

  24. My mortgage was a fixed rate. Some of the things the mortgage broker said to me did not seem right, but I didn’t know why. Now I can see lots of the info he gave me was a bunch of crap. I admit that the mortgage process was foreign to me. Broker insisted we take out more money than we wanted. We just wanted to refinance at a lower rate. He didn’t like the first appraisal we got so he ordered another. We never got a copy of the appraisal. The extra money we got we immediately applied it back to the balance due, so we didn’t use the extra money to buy toys. We did get a mortgage that we could afford but when the ecomony went all to hell, things changed. I have no clue as to who the orignal lender is because the loan paperwork lists 2 different original lenders. So no matter what type of loan you got, you were set up to fail.

  25. Thank you Carie, Thank you Tim.

  26. AND as ANONYMOUS posted:

    “If need to bring in BK — do so.
    Use FDCPA — and TILA Amendment — for fraud in identification of CURRENT creditor. And, fraud upon court — if necessary.
    That is the only law consumer has on side. ”

  27. perusing some of the links on the right hand side of the pages…Neil, you really need to do some housecleaning. wacky conspiracy stuff over there…http://www.rense.com/general64/skold.htm

  28. tn—I don’t have it—ANONYMOUS does—

  29. What is the standardization of underwriting, title exmaining/abstracting, and closing procedures including the process after the deal is closed in additions to those certifications process of title insurance industries?

  30. Today’s FED’s FOMC announcement is incredible. Another round of BAILOUT to purchase the MBS/long term treasuries of 400 billion dollars. Free out the liabilities of banks so that those accountable can create more ponzi scheme/casino to pump the sectors of the market to make money by using leverages….

    Operation Twist = Squeeze the tax payers with more twist of FED by not increasing their book…

    Unethical, Immoral, and illegal professional conducts of Federal reserve. And Federal reserve is fining those banks a little to let them get away with the day rape and ignoring the people of the U.S.

  31. Appraisals are BS. Just look at your local appraisal districts….. They pump your house values dispite of the market sales prices in your neighborhood. They are a part of frauds to steal the money away from the local tax payers to support their local government. Their system need to be reformed also.

  32. The banksters (obamas’ Boys) have been downgraded

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/21/moodys-downgrades-bofas-credit-rating_n_974077.html

    Money talks Just look at the charts

    http://quotes.wsj.com/BAC

  33. The live protest on Wall street.

    http://www.livestream.com/globalrevolution

  34. I would agree. Barnes does seem effective, but he requires local counsel with whom to associate. finding the local counsel is his problem though, not yours

  35. @ JOANNE

    Here is a possibility, I’ve heard good things…

    Jeff Barnes
    Foreclosure Defense Nationwide

    Let me know

  36. Can anyone answer my question? Original mortgage 80/20 august 04 with decision one mortgage HSBC. Transferred to countrywide in dec 05 also
    Refinanced second mortgage in 05 with first magnus, then defaulting on first mortgage with countrywide in august of 06 and still getting.
    approve on a second yes second refi on second mortgage in October of 06. How the hell can that happen? If the first mortgage was in default?

  37. @carie – please share this physical proof. the last i heard it was still contained in the proprietary database with the lender

  38. thank you e tolle. although a lot of people around this area believe he hailed from Tuscaloosa and wore a lot of houndstooth…

  39. @ Joanne

    Without an attorney that has real verifiably experience it will be tuff. I wish I could say that going it pro se would work but the law is very complicated and the banks and debt collectors have presumption on their side.
    Send out your letters and make a bunch of appointments with BK attorneys and tell them you want the debt proven.
    Good luck

  40. @joane – that’s interesting. the only one of those statements that makes any kind of sense is the first one, and it’s so over simplified as to be almost wrong in itself.

  41. I have talked to 3 different attorneys here in OK and I was even more confused. The first attorney said that it was the “note” that was enforceable and that whoever had a copy of it was the owner! Second attorney was a BK attorney and said that I would have to sign a document saying that the Title to the property was clear and that I owed the money to the Servicer! The third attorney said he usually represented banks but said he would try to help. (yikes!) The reason I like this site is that even tho there are differences of opinion, there is also a group concern for one another. There is an underlying trust here that I think we all feel. We have all been lied to and beaten down so much by so many, that I think we need to know things are genuine here.
    Thats why I like it, and thats why I sincerely appreciate the knowledge and opinions I have gotten from everyone. What a generous act it is for so many of you to take time out of your own lives to sit down and give your thoughts, info, experience and advise to a complete stranger. I am grateful.

  42. and by “qualified” i in no way mean to suggest they are ignorant or otherwise uninformed. but does Tim maintain professional liability coverage to insure against errors and omissions?

  43. carie – that’s simply not true and surely you know it. the majority of mortgage loans out there are not subprime. if subprime was in the majority, then by definition they would be prime.

  44. Sorry for the double post, I was on the phone and distracted, here is the cleaned up post. Ignore the post just previous to this post.

    Neil,

    This is a bit off topic for your post here but I was researching this issue and wanted to get your view. I hold an MBS in quantitative finance and accounting and help friends with research in this area, specifically as related to structured finance.

    Many of your blogs note that PSAs generally require servicers to advance P&I payments to lenders in connection with defaulted loans. Subsequently, it is maintained that such loans are technically not in default.

    As I researched the issue I noted Florida courts have held (at the DCA level) that the collateral source rule applies to contracts as well as torts. If that is the case, does a servicer’s advance of payments on a defaulted loan fall under the collateral source doctrine? Alternatively, and if collateral source applies with respect to mortgage insurance and servicer payments under PSAs, do payments by servicers of P&I cure the default such that the cure is fatal to disallowing credits for advances under the collateral source doctrine?

  45. …and it’s NOT a “theory”—it’s FACT. ANONYMOUS has the physical proof.

  46. the frequent commenters here are more informed than the vast majority of attorneys I’ll grant you. with that said, go get a litigator to be your co-counsel. if you know your case, you can explain it to the attorney, and they can use their skills and knowledge to present the case. it’s not a terribly unusual idea. in every single attorney client relationship the client knows the specifics of their case more intimately than their attorney does.

    is the attorney who “gets it” more of an issue of finances or the attorney’s knowledge base? because the 2nd can be learned and/or taught by you

  47. Subprime/alt a purchase and refinance were MOST of the fake “loans”…

  48. Neil,

    This is a bit off topic for your post here but I was researching this issue and wanted to get your view. I hold an MBS in quantitative finance and accounting and help friends with research in this area, specifically as related to structured finance.

    Many of your blogs note that PSAs generally require servicers to advance P&I payments to lenders where in connection with defaulted loans. Subsequently, it is maintained by you and others that such loans are technically not in default.

    As I researched the issue I note that Florida courts have held at the DCA level that the collateral source rule applies to contracts as well as torts. If that is the case, does a servicer’s advance of payments on a defaulted loan fall under the collateral source doctrine? Alternatively, and if collateral source applies with respect to mortgage insurance and servicer payments under PSAs, do payments by servicers of P&I cure the default such that the cure is fatal to disallowing credits for advances under the collateral source doctrine?

  49. tnharry—the people who are supposedly “qualified” to give advice are in denial about the truth—and we are out of time—attorneys aren’t helping people keep their homes—what the hell are we supposed to do??? Wait until they “get it??? We should be able to use the FDCPA and TILA to help us—why aren’t attorneys doing that???

  50. @carie – why do you keep trying to apply your subprime theory to ALL loans? as angry as you guys got at Pat and Enraged, surely you have to agree that the methodology of the argument is flawed. by constantly arguing the broad generalities you leave yourself open to attack. that was my point earlier in the week when I said you’re missing the trees for the forest…facts do matter

  51. GOD has spoken. Who would have thought GOD hailed from Tennessee?

  52. “…originators who had no risk in the deal because they were using their own money to fund the loan. ”

    No “funding” Neil—no “mortgages”…remember?

    False default—cash out receivables securitzed…remember?

    Debt collectors stealing houses…remember?

    Guess you don’t remember…sigh.

  53. I am in Oklahoma. I do not have any problems filing a BK if it will save my house. It’s hard to find a lawyer here that “gets It”. I was reading this morning that lawyers are going to start coming to Oklahoma because of the need to help out here! Hope so.

  54. and if the W9 was a necessary step in the mod and joane follows Tim’s advice and refuses to send it, what then? the W9 is pretty harmless and doesn’t validate anything. joane – why do you keep soliciting advice from people not qualified to give it?

  55. Thank you Tim:) Good Info! I have a Dispute of Debt letter and a QWR typed up. Should I send them both out? They got my loan the middle of July, nothing has been recorded since original mortgage in 2005.

  56. BAC is down nearly 5% as of this post. This would mean that Buffet’s $5 billion is toast or nearly so, unless of course his good buddy Barack comes to his rescue. Buffet may just change his mind about ponying up more on his tax return. I wish them all insolvency and foreclosure, followed by destitution. So sue me.

  57. @ Joane

    Keep this in mind, you dont have to be insolvent to file a BK 13 case and it will put your past due amounts into a payment plan to save your house. Also here is the big help…. a good litigating BK attorney can force this debt collector to prove up claim.
    What state are you in?

  58. Thank you Tim:) Good Info! I have a Dispute of Debt letter and a QWR typed up. Should I send them both out?

  59. @ Joane,

    It looks to me as you have been denied your mod and your loan has been sold to a debt collector at a discount. They are trying to get you to validate the debt.
    Research how to, and demand that they prove ownership.
    Also, once a mortgage is sold during default the new servicer is a debt collector bound by federal collection law including TILA that states the sale must be recorded.

  60. Thank you Tim. Wonder why they sent it?

  61. The parallel issue that did not get addressed is the that people with home equity in their home, even if they have plenty of home equity in their home, may not be allowed access to it if they are unemployed.

    In terms of divide and conquer, because so much attention is being paid to people who are underwater, those underwater don’t care much that someone with equity could lose it all because they are unemployed.

    And that is another dividing line that is preventing a coalition among homeowners to form.

  62. Recontrust, (BAC Home Loans Servicing) created their own title Company, several other related subsidiaries, and their own Real Estate Company!

  63. @ Joana,

    Don’t supply anything to a debt collector.

  64. Oh, sorry, I forgot to add: the form they sent was already filled out with the Social Security # on it. I guess they just want a signature?

  65. My loan was transferred to a new servicer right in the middle of a loan mod. Today I got a W-9 form, (Request for Taxpayer Identification Number and Certification) from the new servicer. Why would they want this? I was 3 months behind when my loan was transferred to them, now I am 6 months behind. Should I fill the form out for them? Thanks All

  66. I appolgise in advance if this comment posts twice but I just signed up for an account and it appears as if the first comment never posted?

    Hello Everyone,

    I just got a letter from a law firm representing Aurora FSB f/k/a Aurora Loan services.

    They provided me with copies of a note endorsed in blank (With no assignments). The collateral file checklist says the assignments are missing and are to be ordered from MERS.
    Financing/Payoff statement. It did not account for the entire life of the loan.

    It stated “Aurora Bank has the right to enforce the Note evidencing the debt, and has the right to receive payment of the debt for and on behalf of the owner of the debt” It also states The current owner of the debt is “Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas,…”

    It lists proff of claim as Copy of the Borrower’s Note, Security Instument, Payoff Statement, loan history and other documents enclosed with the letter.

    Does anyone have any ideas how to respond. It appears as if the note is endorsed in blank is ok in AZ as a bearer instrument under the UCC.

    I’m trying to put together a response but my time is very limited. The letter states I only have 30 days to respond as of Sept10. (I didn’t know they worked on weekends)

    Thank you.

  67. Bank of America-ReconTrust to Face State Court Judicial Process in Illegal Homeowner Foreclosures

    by Morgan Skinner

    Published – 09/20/11 – 07:29 AM | 0 | 3 | |

    (Salt Lake City, UT) – St. George attorney John Christian Barlow, representing homeowners who have lost their home to the Bank of America’s (NYSE: “BAC”) foreclosure machine ReconTrust, may have finally achieved a measure of success in the battle of Utah homeowners against ReconTrust’s illegal foreclosures.

    Federal Judge Clark Waddoups Thursday returned to Utah Fifth District Court in St. George a case in which ReconTrust was named as a third-party in the complaint claiming immunity under the National Bank Act in an unlawful detainer action. (ORDER and MEMORANDUM DECISION)

    Attorney Barlow explains the legal steps taken to help Utah homeowners protect their rights under State statutes in this exclusive interview with KCSG News.
    http://www.kcsg.com/view/full_story/15588516/article-Bank-of-America-ReconTrust-to-Face-State-Court-Judicial-Process-in-Illegal-Homeowner-Foreclosures-?instance=home_first_stories

  68. @bytheway – i’ve seen the same oblique references by Neil to title insurors denying coverage but haven’t seen anything other than his references to whispers in the hallways. i deal with two of the major companies on a regular basis and it’s business as usual. no news from local land title organizations either…

    you really don’t have to pump up Neil – everyone knows he has some good information. but all of his pieces don’t have to be home runs. this one, for instance, is especially odd as an example of “the truth and reality of the situation” since it contains no real facts – it’s an editorial, an opinion piece. the fact that you clearly agree with it and believe it (and I’m not saying I don’t before you start arguing) doesn’t make it truth or reality. it’s still opinion

  69. Hello Everyone,

    I just got a letter from a law firm representing Aurora FSB f/k/a Aurora Loan services.

    They provided me with copies of a note endorsed in blank (With no assignments). The collateral file checklist says the assignments are missing and are to be ordered from MERS.
    Financing/Payoff statement. It did not account for the entire life of the loan.

    It stated “Aurora Bank has the right to enforce the Note evidencing the debt, and has the right to receive payment of the debt for and on behalf of the owner of the debt” It also states The current owner of the debt is “Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas,…”

    It lists proff of claim as Copy of the Borrower’s Note, Security Instument, Payoff Statement, loan history and other documents enclosed with the letter.

    Does anyone have any ideas how to respond. It appears as if the note is endorsed in blank is ok in AZ as a bearer instrument under the UCC.

    I’m trying to put together a response but my time is very limited. The letter states I only have 30 days to respond as of Sept10. (I didn’t know they worked on weekends)

    Thank you.

  70. Hello Everyone,

    I just got a letter from a law firm representing Aurora FSB f/k/a Aurora Loan services.

    They provided me with copies of a note endorsed in blank (With no assignments). The collateral file checklist says the assignments are missing and are to be ordered from MERS.
    Financing/Payoff statement. It did not account for the entire life of the loan.

    It stated “Aurora Bank has the right to enforce the Note evidencing the debt, and has the right to receive payment of the debt for and on behalf of the owner of the debt” It also states The current owner of the debt is “Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas,…”

    It lists proff of claim as Copy of the Borrower’s Note, Security Instument, Payoff Statement, loan history and other documents enclosed with the letter.

    Does anyone have any ideas how to respond. It appears as if the note is endorsed in blank is ok in AZ as a bearer instrument under the UCC.

    I’m trying to put together a response but my time is very limited. The letter states I only have 30 days to respond as of Sept10. (I didn’t know they worked on weekends)

    Thank you.

  71. tnharry- also there are some companies declaring they will not write title insurance on secrutized loans.Reality!

  72. tnharry

    the truth and reality of the situation is not a fear tactic. Neil is and has been ahead of the curve on all of this for years!

  73. and that’s why we have title insurance…the situation is dire enough without playing up the fear tactics

  74. as the home prices fall & homeowners are removed 1 at a time,the title co/ servicers / investment banks with create the nation of renters
    built on debt collectors at the controls.!
    the general public is not in a good position “unless bent over” is the pov from the $ interstes.

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