Once again, we find that jobless claims “exceeded” expectations. Whose expectation? The only people publicly expecting and privately using these expectations are campaign managers. With the housing, the nation’s largest asset, in a continual nosedive for four years, higher jobless claims and lower economic figures are inevitable.

The expectation game is played by economists and politicians, Wall Street brokers who want to churn more stock and bond transactions, and of course the media, which wants to create the appearance of an up and down suspense so you keep reading and watching.

Here’s the truth: Joblessness has still not hit bottom but the rate at which it is worsening is better than at the time of the crash. The economy is also continuing to get worse, with lower personal income, far less credit for people and businesses, and savings struggling. There just isn’t any money to buy anything, which means no revenue, no profits, no jobs, and no tax revenue. $7 trillion was directly removed from our economy by Wall Street plus, I would estimate, another $20 trillion in indirect consequences that will be felt for decades.

There is a way out of this. TELL THE TRUTH. AND starting acting on the Truth. Allowing the housing market to turn into a foreclosure free-for-all was an error of both BUSH and OBAMA administrations. Neither one realized the relationship between foreclosures and the prospects for the U.S. economy and their own political prospects.

If the foreclosures are REAL because the mortgages are REAL and the LIEN IS PERFECTED, and the obligation is UNPAID, and the NOTE describes the obligation and the MORTGAGE SECURES THE NOTE AND OBLIGATION and the REAL CREDITOR is following the law, then the foreclosures should proceed. If not, the foreclosures should not proceed. If the obligation has been extinguished then that is where the chips fee. And for a change the common man will get the collateral benefit from Wall Street antics.

Regardless of your politics, you must admit that as long as these foreclosures continue, the outlook is worse than bleak for all economic indicators, social unrest and potential military conflict. Under a nation of laws the chips fall wherever they fall and the consequences must be absorbed. Under anation governed by men instead of laws, anything goes, creating uncretainty, the worst condition for any market or economy.

So if the homeowners are in fact deadbeats whose eyes were too big for the stomach then by all means let the foreclosures continue. And if Wall Street created a grand illusion of loan closings, securitizations, and foreclosures, then let the the illusion be dropped.

With the illusion dropped, the $7 trillion reappears and the economy takes off. So there is motivation to take a close look at the lawfulness of the mortgages and the securitizations and the foreclosures. Our title crisis, market crisis and economy depend upon it.

74 Responses

  1. […] 14.BE PART OF THE SOLUTION INSTEAD OF THE SPIN « Livinglies’s … Jun 23, 2011 … The debtor claims he never got a summons and complaint so he didn’t ….. hi debbi i have an appt with KEL law group next thursday (finally) will … […]

  2. @ Shelley A. Erickson

    Have you really LOOKED at those Western Union FEES? I really doubt you did.

    It is FAR cheaper to buy a money order for $.75 and then either mail it or use an expedited delivery such as Priority Mail.

    And for online purchases that do not take any type of check, go to WalMart and get one of the ‘Green Dot’ type of DEBIT cards.The cards are NOT connected to any personal bank account. They also do not have any type of over-draft fee if a debit is attempted for more than the amount of funds available. You do need to know that the initial packet does not have your permanent card in it. You can put money on the ‘temporary’ card but you can not add funds until the permanent card imprinted with your name arrives in the mail.

    There is a fee to load the cards. You can load up to $1100.00 for a single fee of under $5.00 and you can add those funds directly to the permanent card at any cash register at Walmart. You can also buy ‘money packs’ at numerous other locations.

    The cards do have a monthly fee but that is waived if you deposit at least $1000 onto the card each month OR if you have DIRECT DEPOSIT to the card.

    With the elimination of any chance of an overdraft fee, yet the convenience of use of the VISA system to purchase, I find this to be the best alternative.

    I refuse to use Western Union for their over-priced ‘convenience’ of sending cash.

  3. Tony, Tony, Tony. You cite law from 1888 as if it still applies. Actually check and see if it’s still good law before quoting it to people that may try to use it. It’s not. This is simply not the state of the law as it pertains to secured liens and bankruptcy. Absent a specific action to avoid a lien, any secured lien remains attached to the property pledged. Applies to real or personal property.

    Go out and try your plan in real life and report back to us all how that works for you.

  4. @Tony: so long as we have nitwits acting like lawyers, we’ll never get anywhere.

    Speaking of which……..I had a nice conversation with a 20 year practicing real estate attorney yesterday. We sat down, compared notes.

    He assured me I could argue these points in front of a judge better than he could. Not to say that he wouldn’t represent me, he will. But he reinforced my confidence greatly.

    He also acknowledged that this is a brave new world, and everything we thought was “legit” no longer is.

  5. Tnharry,

    I showed you case law by the supreme court of the land and recent supreme court of Illinois, and all you have to come back with is ask a bk attorney? What kinda of come back was that. Remember what I wrote before you responded: ”

    To long we have so called “lawyers” acting like they know everything when in truth they are only saying what they are fed to know.”

    Look at you right on Que you came back with the very same thing I said would happened, you just said ask a bk attorney. Isn’t this the same group of people that filed fraudulent documents into the court?
    Isn’t this the same group that acts like they are working for the so called banks, when in turn they just brought charged off debt instruments? Yet you want the public to run back and ask them? I will just say, it is a very sad day in this country that a lawyers come back is ask someone else instead of doing his or her own due diligence and researching the facts himself.

    Lets educate the public and show that we want to help everyone and to knock out theories trim all the fat off of people cases. So at the end of the day the american public that look on this public forum can use it to protect there rights.

    It doesn’t matter if the person is wrong or right, but that we go into detail about the issue pick it apart fully take out the rights and wrongs and give the public what they need.

  6. dododododo: I remember reading that too, think I read on Huff Po. I also remember a story about how a sting was set up to bust a collection agency who had the audacity to have a “fake court” set up for the sole purpose of intimidating debtors. I do believe these slimeballs did get busted. Haven’t heard about their sentencing though – did they pay someone off?

  7. About Jeffrey Stearns. I remember reading quite while ago a case that sounds similiar to this. The article was talking about debtor’s prisons still in the US. I am going from memory so I may not have the facts and you may want to disregard this post. In the story I read, I believe that the guy was from Minnesota, a well known sleazy collectioin agency sued the debtor, the debtor did not show up for court, and an arrest warrant was put out for him. The debtor claims he never got a summons and complaint so he didn’t know he was being sued. Sewer service!! I think the collection agency had something to do with the arrest warrant, but not sure how that worked. I also remember reading a comment that this happens a lot in Minnesota. You don’t show up for court, an arrest warrant is issued is what I got from the story.

  8. And @Mary, I agree. There must be more to that story. You don’t go to jail JUST for owing money. There was something else going on. I tried google but couldn’t find anything.

  9. I side with tnharry on the lien surviving. After BK its just personally uncollectable. That’s my understanding, as a debtor going through the BK court, who asked her attorney a lot of questions.

  10. @Tony – you’re just plain wrong on that. Ask any bk atty. A discharge clears personal obligation on the debt. The lien survives.

  11. You will find a list of Fraudsters & Co-Conspirators that has about a four page list of all the fraudster lenders and a list of Robo signers below that! I , my sister and my son are sending notices to all parties and carriers and notaries like Neil said to do, that are a part of our mortgage fraud. Type in Mortgage Servicing Fraud, then click onto the one that has the word FORUM in it. Then click onto the left column that says Fraudsters and Co-conspirators. Good luck in finding a bank that is not on this list. Also look up the bank or lender on the web and put fraudster with it. You find the ones that are fraudsters and have even paid millions of penalties in the past for the same crime and are still doing foreclosures.


  13. cubed2k i recommend everyone to read your U tube post above and spread the word on their computers to others. Predators rely on putting fear into their victims. The only way the can succeed is silence by the victim and instilling fear. As soon as the silence is broken and the fear is taken out of the issues, they get caught, fail and go to jail.

  14. Boycott the Foreclosing Banks. They are stealing someone’s home, if not yours.

    USE CASH and someday silver.

    I do.

    No more 3%-4% Visa profits on every transaction, over and over. No more fractional reserve profiteering on puny interest to your account. No more control over our liqudity.

    We CANNOT coexist with these fraudulent banks.

    It’s either we as Americans survive or them and their phony pretender ‘debts’.

    Let them flush like they should have done in November 2008. We and our homes will then survive.

  15. cube2k; Yes if all the employees of these bankster criminals would walk out on their jobs and refuse to commit criminal acts the banksters crooks would have a hard time doing their dirty deeds. Their employees are all (no matter what their job is) “ALL” directly legally responsible for their crimes. Perhaps if they were made aware of this and see the banks are beginning to loose their steam against homeowners and the courts, they may all walk away. I will dig up the law that states all their employees are liable for their crimes and post it. Along with the Whistle Blowing laws, where they can receive ten to fifteen percent of the funds the government receives back from the criminals for whistle blowing, greedy for money or not the employees have double incentives to not only walk out, but blow the whistle. They are legally liable. How could these criminals function without all the helpers? I was wondering I have letters of notices to mail ready except one statute I am looking for, to send to all parties including the department of records, I am wondering would it be beneficial to send a notice to our local Sheriff’s departments also? The Sheriffs and Judges? Would that do any good? Seems like it should. The Sheriff are the ones that carry out the dirty deeds in the end due to orders caused by fraud upon the courts.

  16. @ stunned. Thanks for the info and I was in no way meaning to settle for 3K. That would really be silly and 3K is an INSULT and I’d blow it off too. In your original comment you said 3T (a typo?) so I wasn’t sure about the figure. In settling a case, I’m thinking more like 80% of fair market value. Good luck in your case!

  17. This is excellent. Busted Washington Mutual CC with Prejudice.


  18. If I had a small deli shop on Wall Street or a restaurant, I would put up “Most Wanted” list with pictures, and
    if Jamie Dimon, Lord Frankenstein, Ken Lewis, any wall st trader for GS, JPM, BofA, etc

    came in to buy a hamburger or deli sandwich or whatever, why I’m afraid the price of the burger is $200.00 for you guys. Oh, you want some water? 50 bucks

    of course if you had a lunch place by any NA Bank, why any employee coming in for food would be hit with the same prices. Sorry employees you should not be working for these outfits, gangsters banksters.

  19. @MaryCochrane:

    “In September 2009, Jeffrey Stearns, a concrete-company owner, answered a knock at the door from a Hancock County, Ind., deputy sheriff. The deputy was holding a warrant to arrest Stearns for not paying $4,024.88 owed to a unit of American International Group Inc. on a loan for his pickup truck. After being handcuffed in front of his four children, Stearns, 29 years old, spent two nights in jail, where he said he was strip-searched and sprayed for lice. Court records show he was released after agreeing to pay $1,500 to the loan company. “I didn’t even know I was being sued,”

    I don’t believe that story. Something was left out.

    If you ask me that story was designed to do one thing, keep people in fear and keep them paying or not defaulting.

    ” In order to go to prison you must be convicted of criminal behavior.”

    “Here are your options with debt you’re defaulting on:
    1. Settle your debt (but you’ll need some cash).
    2. File bankruptcy (an often nightmare).
    3. Ignore it and possibly go to jail for contempt of a court order (very rare).
    4. Start paying it back in full.”

    Of course I did number 2, which was the cubed2k way – I filed my own personnel bankruptcy without seeking anybodies permission. I declared myself bankrupt to myself and thereafter have ignored all phone calls and pieces of paper in the mail. Since I have no assets, make a living, there is nothing to distribute. And there is no way I’m gonna pay some collection company, they can kiss my arse.

    And to think I get offers in the mail to apply for a credit card – says you’ve had a rough time, get back on your feet with this new credit card.

    From above link:

    ” However, the U.S. government has a vested interest in making debt a desirable circumstance”

    I’ve come to the conclusion that if the US Gov says to do something, run the other way.

    If the US Gov says not to do something, do it.

  20. @tnharry

    I followed up on your suggestion to make sure we did not we did not give up our ability to bring suit since we filed Chap. 7 and had the 341 meeting on 6/2. We received notice that the trustee abandoned the property as well as filed his determination that it is a “no” asset case.
    I listed the secured debt as contested and challenged on the schedule.

    I am in the process of completing the Complaint and plan to file it sometime next week in the District Bankruptcy Court as an adversary pleading.

    I wrote a letter to the Trustee and let him know of my intent on filing as well as asking him to let me know if there is anything that I need to do or to file to protect my interest and proceed against the pretend lender. I sent the letter certified mail return receipt and he personally signed for rreceipt of the letter. I also sent a copy to the attorney who handled the Chap. 7, however, he already told us he wants nothing further to do with the case. I did not receive any response from the Trustee and, as stated, still plan on filing early next week.

    The lender did not file a claim and I know they are not required to as it is secured, however, we have received a letter from the law firm stating they have begun foreclosure action with a demand letter for the amount they claim is owed. In my eyes and because they did not file a proof of claim with the court, my complaint among other things will challenge standing, capacity, as well as validation based on their foreclosure letter to me. Any more suggestions. I know there is another post that refers to BK so I thought this might help more than just me. Thank you.

  21. Tnharry,

    No wonder people go pro se, look what you are telling people and you suppose to be a lawyer.

    Why are you lying to the public that a lien survives a bankruptcy? It does not and I have broken this down so many times its crazy. I have also asked you and anyone else to read the case law that proves the case. I will break it down one LAST time.

    Freeman v. Alderson, 119 U.S. 185 (1888) was about a case about in rem, in personam, quasi in rem. Justice Field describes the meaning in this:
    “There is, however, a large class of cases which are not strictly actions in rem, but are frequently spoken of as actions quasi in rem, because, though brought against persons, they only seek to subject certain property of those persons to the discharge of the claims asserted. Such are actions in which property of nonresidents is attached and held for the discharge of debts due by them to citizens of the state, and actions for the enforcement of mortgages and other liens.”

    “Indeed, all proceedings having for their sole object the sale or other disposition of the property of the defendant to satisfy the demands of the plaintiff are in a general way thus designated. But they differ, among other things, from actions which are strictly in rem in that the interest of the defendant is alone sought to be affected, that citation to him is required, and that judgment therein is only conclusive between the parties.”

    With judge Fields saying this it clearly shows banks have no In rem, and if they do not reaffirm a mortgage in a bankruptcy they have no claim period. Long v Bullard was about if you try to conceal your property, the court sees it as fraud and seizes the property. If you discharge a mortgage in Bankruptcy and the banks do not reaffirm it, there is no fraud. What it is called is victory by windfall because they might not want to do it, but they have to because it is the correct ruling. They sat there and waived there right to the property. Reason is because they can not go after the person thus can not reach the property. In short courts can not have subject matter jurisdiction because they can not reach the res. It is so because the federal law protects you.Like justice fields said they need you to reach the property, because the property did not do any wrong. You have a federal injunction to stop banks from doing this. All it needs to be done is to make the courts enforce it.

    Long v. Bullard, 117 U.S. 617 (1886) was before in rem was revisited in 1888 in In re Freeman. Instead of using the supreme court ruling on jurisdiction by judge Feilds, banks and the supreme court act like In re Freeman never happened. Ask the Illinois Supreme Court that ruled in 2010 in the case of ABN Amro Mortgage Group, Inc. v. McGahan that now has ruled that foreclosures are not In rem. ABN Amro Mortgage Group, Inc. v. McGahan should be read very deeply they go into very in depth into the whole In rem, In personam, Quasi in rem jurisdiction.

    To long we have so called “lawyers” acting like they know everything when in truth they are only saying what hey are fed to know. Then when they don’t want to see the truth they say “oh you in that crazy movement” to make them sound good.

    You know what is funny, the person in the supreme court case is name Freeman.

  22. Not appraisal fraud – its ‘Asset Portfolio’ Insurance Fraud! Why are the ‘Title Corporation’ owners not coming forth?

    Back in 1995, you’ll see the S3 and S3/A (big bucks) SASCO for example, placed $45,000,000,000 billion dollars into one S3.

    Ask yourself what was $45,000,000,000 billion dollars worth today?
    If the ‘mortgage markets’ were so depressed, how did the commercial banks turn around the residential mortgage markets?

    Ahhaaaaa – they purchased all existing ‘Mortgage Notes’ and controlled the information flow so that anytime consumer filed for a mortgage, the real ‘owner of the mortgage note’ and real ‘servicer’ …

    What’s S3 Form got to do with PSA? Everything!

    ‘Issuing Entity’ fictitious name for ‘Registrant’ a pass-thru-agency such as SASCO for Lehman Brothers Bank FSB whose ‘cash deposits’ were placed into residential investments!

    Rolling six months the S3 takes ‘assets’ of existing ‘mortgage notes’ over and over and over…. find your S3 form.

    Neil something to add to your audit reports! Questions on how to isolate and find the ‘S3’ governing the ‘FWP’ and Supplemental Prospectus of the ‘Issuing entity’ send email

  23. They probably are going back to the old ‘debtor’s prison’ and will take your first born.

    More than a third of all U.S. states allow borrowers who can’t or won’t pay to be jailed. judges across the nation said the number of borrowers threatened with arrest in their courtrooms has surged since the financial crisis began.

    Wall Street Journal Jessic Silver-Greenberg story written by Ashby Jones can be googled.

    “In September 2009, Jeffrey Stearns, a concrete-company owner, answered a knock at the door from a Hancock County, Ind., deputy sheriff. The deputy was holding a warrant to arrest Stearns for not paying $4,024.88 owed to a unit of American International Group Inc. on a loan for his pickup truck. After being handcuffed in front of his four children, Stearns, 29 years old, spent two nights in jail, where he said he was strip-searched and sprayed for lice. Court records show he was released after agreeing to pay $1,500 to the loan company. “I didn’t even know I was being sued,”

    How common will the Debt bondage of ancient GREECE? Did I say Ancient Greece? Economic crises in Athens around 600BCE had resulted in so many Athenians sold into slavery

    During Europe’s Middle Ages, debtors, both men and women, were locked up together in a single large cell until their families paid their debt.

    Hey the way American families don’t stick together! and the Legislature turns their back on residents and citizens, we’ll be sold as slaves in the LIBOR exchange! as an unsecured debt!

  24. @Pat – generally Bk will discharge a debt even if it’s not specifically listed. This is particularly true with a mortgage, if you listed an entity and it turns out to be another. I’m not following the rest of your comment though. Even if you get a discharge, the lien against the property survives. They can still foreclose, they just can’t get any money directly out of you due to the discharge.

  25. I think the FEMA camps would be a great place as a “makeshift” prision for all the fraudsters. They can have their very own exclusive
    FEMA camp club….wealmostgottawaywitit.

  26. @enoughalready

    I wrote and I would bet his email inbox greatly runeth over from letters and responses just from these sites. The “powerful” ones can’t keep ignoring and turning a blind eye. I heard a lawyer on TV last night that just won a huge case for a group of investors who got duped and his response to the win was as follows, “to make the fraud stop, you have to punish them where it hurts, monetarily. As he said, they understand nothing else nor do they care about anything’s all about money. If they courts uphold the law and hit them hard with each case that comes to their court, they will start getting the message and isn’t that what a court of “EQUITY” is about.

    I also agree with the credit card moritorium. Stop using them. Keep hitting them where it hurts.

  27. I am, more of a reader then one to comment, for the most part that will not change.
    I have been reading and living IT long enough to know part of the pressure placed on every individual that has or is going through IT.

    Did I say how much I love this site?

    we need a sound board. Just as we need a Louie and TN, The A man and many others here.
    Granted, it gets off topic, but it always gets back on point.

    nitwit or neilhead? Its your right, just as its Neil’s right to post whatever, and, he allows us to do the same.

    @ Zoe, well said! but,
    It wasn’t just said as “us little people”, it is ” those who hold on
    to religion and guns.” Thank God we still have those!

    Is it that hard to see that the whole world is Living Lies?

    May God stay with those who see and give sight to the blinded.

    Did I say how much I love this site….

  28. Okay, folks, some are getting off topic. (Really!) I save every one of Neil’s comments, as I have sense enough to know that he has been at this longer than most who visit this site. That said, while his comments do help us to become informed clients or pro se litigant, each case is different. One of his comments might be just what I need, and the next comment might be just what you need. Above all and without question, Neil has spent years encouraging homeowners. He deserves boatloads of gratitude and respect. So what if he gets some of it wrong? This was uncharted water when he willingly jumped in to help the “little people,” as our president called us.

    We need to stay focused on OUR case and OUR state laws that will govern what happens in OUR court appearance. Or else, we will become blind guides, as the Bible explains: ” [Ye] blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel” (Mat 23:24).

    As a defendant, my job is not to educate a judge about securitization or falsified signatures, or other tangents or wild theories, my job is to prove that the plaintiff failed to prove its case against me.

    As much as possible. shoot holes in the plaintiff’s claims, and use Neil’s FREE advice and experienced comments and details to help do so, as is relevant. Strengthen the counterclaims, just don’t go off on a tangent.

    Most foreclosure firms are busy making quick money–so busy they are reckless. Use that propensity to your benefit. Win! The more cases won the better for all of us. Ill-directed cases create bad case law, and that hurts all of us.

    Let’s concentrate on winning our cases by reviewing the matters before the court that specifically relate to our individual cases. We can insult each other and become activists, if we so desire, after we win!

    Remember: If we are in foreclosure, our primary job, with or without an attorney, is to prove that the plaintiff DID NOT prove its case. With every case that is won, homeowners become part of the SOLUTION, not part of the spin.

  29. The banks are being feed to stay alive on the credit card(we should call them debt cards). I don’t even like the debit cards. Pull cash, don’t use credit/debt cards and debit cards. Use western union money orders. Don’t give the bank any reason to charge an NSF fee. Cut them off where it hurts. Banks hold up deposits to cause NSF fees. Pull any money you have and put it in a safe place or put it in a small bank. A lot of customers of mine have moved their money from the big banks to credit unions. I refuse to bank with a big bank. When the debit cards first became popular my business paid the banks over thirty thousand in debt card fees that year, almost as much as my income taxes for the year. Perhaps we can put a list together on recommendations of how to boycott the big banks. And think if you save in advance for a car, or what ever you purchase you will be ahead. Do without until you have cash. Take away their life support.Debt keeps them alive and well and us in debtors prison wither you realize it or not. We have been their slaves. Slavery never ended with the civil war. Credit cards and bank fees and our savings in their bank vaults, created greedy bankster rulers and more slavery. Slaves of most all Americans. They are not to be to fail, they are to big to trust.

  30. I believe the jobless have exceeded the crooks expectations alright. I believe the ponzi schemers did a better job than they thought killing jobs. I believe they are bragging above our heads.And pretending to be shocked. Surprise!~ surprise! More insurance money, more late fees, HAMP programs to use to steal more homes. TARP money to steal billions of dollars in taxes and lots and lots of free houses. It could not have gotten any better for them until…………… I believe the one thing they did not expect was to get caught. They did not expect people to chat and communicate on the web and put the puzzle together. And there will be an even greater surprise when they pay for their crimes. “There is room for over 300 million of them in the prisons built. There should be at least a dozen of them for each of these prisons. It is absolutely outrageous some of them are not in prison already, cell mats to Madoff ( who -Madoff with lots of money), and the last guy that just got sentenced. I can not remember his name yet. I have to look him up every time. Soon there will be so many in prison we wont be able to keep up with the names.. Americans will make sure they pay for these crimes. It is not over yet! They days of trust are over.

  31. lets see, heard on CNBC stock tv show, last week………

    price of oil/gas – questioned asked was how much of the price is based on speculation trading in the markets? Answer by one of those talking paid hacks was 20-40%.

    There you go. that’s a lot. It ain’t shit at $1.00 gallon gas, but it’s a lot at $4.00 dollar gas. Over time and continual usage, like weekly – your basic toll booth.

    Let’s extrapolate, let’s see what has Wall Street turned into a trading game? EVERYTHING. MBS, ABS – what are the components of MBS & ABS – everything borrowed from a financial institution – cars, credit cards, store credit cards, payday loans – it’s all been jacked up by 20-40%. Consumer products all turned into trading on Wall St by using your credit promise to pay and plastic.

    Sure, use your credit card and pay it off every month, you think you are ahead. NOT. You just contributed to the credit/banking system when you use your credit card or credit (promise to pay).

  32. Mr. Bryl, Mr. Jan Van Eck or anyone else who can answer.

    What happens to so many of us who went through Bankruptcy in the last few years and named the servicer ( pretender lender ) in their cases.

    Have they really received a discharge if the wrong party was named in the Bankruptcy case?

    The Bankruptcy Court seems the place that is getting the most traction on these issues.

    If someone is still in the house and foreclosure has not been filed does the homeowner have any options within bankruptcy court to bring this to the attention of the judge years later after discharge?

    Or should they just try and fight this in a wrongful foreclosure in the court ?

    Any thoughts would be appreciated for others reading.

  33. when I was trading stocks full time from home with my little trading account of a few thousand bucks, and I was checking the yahoo finance boards everyday and minute, back in the dot com era, there is always a tnharry to fuck with yah. Always, still true to this day. It’s a hard one to figure out. There’s always the guy that introduces “doubt” into one’s mind ———–what about this, what about that, who says so, why, on and on.

    Does it really fuk’in matter, stay as long as you can, go cash, no credit, save as much as you can. Figure it out.

  34. The faster we mainstream our issues the faster we win. We need to convince somehow the large lawfirms that it is Economically in their advantage to side with the homeowners.

    And it has nothing to do at this point who is right and who is wrong.
    Everybody knows the banksters are wrong. Everybody. This is not the point. We need Big Attorney firms on our side.

    Money Talks and B–lsh%t walks.


  35. Like I said people need to get their head out of the sand. Who would have believed the banks, government, judicial system, regulators, foreclosure mills, massive amounts of criminal attorneys, a bar association that would go after the good honest attorneys, and I could go on and on, would have ever have gotten to this point and millions of victims and their families would loose their incomes and homes? Who would have believed the pretender lenders would be stealing thousands and millions of free houses? It is all like a big bad dream. Makes you wonder how the evil doers and their helpers sleep at night. The only way we can beat this, is to inform and become informed and to inform everyone to listen to Neil Garfield and others trying to help us and make huge waves of protest on the internet and in person, without riots, in a peaceful way and to vote out the bad guys. Only fools stick their head in the sand. And it is very dangerous for us all to not inform people to keep from rioting. But to try in every way that is peaceful to fight these criminals. Our silence and passive lives thinking all was great and we had good businesses and incomes and golfing gear and nice homes and TV’s, and did not have the time to become aware of our surroundings and the evil creeps creeping up on us, with laws that violate our Constitution and bankers, and government gone drunken wild with greed as we watched TV.

  36. Has anyone found the statute from the State of Washington that states the foreclosure must be a creditor and have an interest in the mortgage. I would think that would be a given, but with all the changes in the laws in Washington State on behalf of the banks I would not count on it. I have have been digging in the wrong spot so far. I can usually come up with the statutes I need.

  37. @Leapfrog it is State District court in a non-judicial state. The offer was from the filing of the complaint only, no discovery has happened. The complaint was just filed on 6/19/11.Thanks for advice on settlement. But 3K doesn’t cover the cost of my attorney’s time for which they are doing this contingent. This bird in the hand will be crushed before we settle for shutting us up. We have nothing to lose and lots to gain. Rolling over NO MORE!

  38. tnharry I agree with you But people are very very complex beings.

  39. Dear enough already, on June 23, 2011 at 7:30 am said:
    hi debbi i have an appt with KEL law group next thursday (finally) will call you do you know anything about this group?????

    Be careful they are on the dark side part of the ‘information services network’ and don’t have your back!

  40. Tnharry,

    You are talking about using words correctly? What happened to who cares about present and represent words didn’t matter. I guess words do matter, but only when when its for you huh. Tisk Tisk

  41. @ diane, foreclosuredefensenationwidedotcom, Jeff Barnes, California. strong referral network. top notch. “BMW” (bring money with)


    Watch this from today’s Dylan Ratigan show–it’s AWESOME!!!

    Finally—publicity on a national TV media show about what is REALLY going on—this is fantastic…the “wall” is cracking!!!
    Niel—can’t you get on his show???

  43. @Louie, why are you obsessed with my bar number and name? And by the way, the word is “you’re” not “your”. Check it out.

  44. Usedkarguy, tnharry, listen it is obvious you to like to massage each others ego, so why don’t you two exchange emails and you two can have as intimate a relationship as you like and spare this website of your antics and childish behaviour.Tnharry your a wannabe lawyer. Your the only proclaimed lawyer on this site that does not identify himself as one. Final comment.


    The new sheriff of Wall Street—watch out, criminals!!

  46. In response to Shelley’s post, I have been hearing over a year now about camps being built in the US. I think they call them FEMA Camps. I have read about these camps on other sites and also heard about them on the radio. I at first thought “no way”. People who are working on these camps are coming forward to tell what they know. We all need to wake up, take a look at what is going on around you, have you seen our rights being taken from us so slowly that you don’t even notice it until one day you say what happened. This is not the Amercia I once knew. There are people planning to destroy our rights. So don’t think that it can’t happen here, it has already begun.

  47. @Stunned: Can you say what court (superior, fed or BK) and what state? If not, I don’t blame you, just wondering. Also, remember the old adage: A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush – not that I’m defending the banksters and I want to see them clobbered. I’m in a suit too, but depending on HOW ATTRACTIVE an offer was, I might strongly think about it. You just never know what will happen if it goes to trial. I had a small claims case I thought was a slam dunk and the other side was offering me a very good settlement, but I decided not to accept it and I had some bogus pro tem judge who ruled against us. Good for you though! I’m glad to see B of A is worried. So far they are ignoring our discovery. Did you get to discovery or were they just trying to settle based on the complaint alone?

  48. An East-Coast (PA) loss for a pretender-lender in bankruptcy; good agency law discussion (as well as other things):

  49. Our attorney got a call from a “BOA attorney” who was wondering if they might be able to settle the case “cheaply”. My attorney called him back, he said if we were still in the house, they’d work a refi and take a hit–when our attorney told him that ship sailed (he hadn’t read the complaint yet) he offered $3T. Our attorney told him that he must convey that offer to us and he would convey our response back to the BOA attorney…but he’d probably have to severely edit our response before repeating it to him—-and our attorney suggested he read the Complaint.
    Our response unedited to our attorney…tell BOA to blow it out their ass!

  50. enough already ,

    e:mail me at brian_tracy AT , I’ll give you a candid review of KEL , I was a client of theirs for a year.

  51. @Louie – i don’t try to find fault with Neil every step of the way. i was pointing out a dearth of useful information this week. maybe Neil’s getting ready for his upcoming seminar, or maybe it’s just been a slow news week. no matter the reason, it comes at a cost to those who come here seeking help in their own struggles. if you’d rather debate whether Obama’s building concentration camps or laud the sovereign citizen movement instead, that’s certainly your prerogative. I’ll be the first to admit I haven’t been here as long as many of the regulars, but for the life of me I can’t recall a recent comment from you that was directed at anything other than me….

  52. There remains yet another reason that housing and new housing construction will remain in a long-terms slump. Remember that much construction is being done by migrants, typically from Latin America. As the construction stops, these families have no income; some will return to Latin America (and some will be deported). Each family that leaves also leaves behind an empty housing unit – house or apartment. Take a few million migrants out of the economy and what do you suppose is going to happen to those empty housing units? They sit, with no takers, either renters or buyers. And that is without the title problems of foreclosed houses.

    Remember this: the natural fecundity (reproduction rate) of the “citizens” is well below replacement rate; without migrants, the total US population is constantly shrinking. A shrinking population implies a continuing housing overstock. The overstock implies little new construction. Little construction implies a stagnant economy and a contraction in GDP; which implies a lower standard of living (except for the rentier class in New York). the new disparities in wealth, plus about 400 million guns, implies assassination of NY bankers as a new social model. Just watch; I predict it is going to get very ugly.

    Whom to blame? Congress, the Administration, but mostly the Judiciary, that refuses to deal with the massive fraud heaped upon the Courts by the New Yorkers.

  53. @ninnyhammer,
    Mr. Garfield is a champion, we know that. I can’t speak for anyone else, but the site has become less than helpful since the legal discussion is all but gone. Nitwits like you (and maybe myself for responding to nitwits like you) have turned this into a sounding board instead of providing legal theories and strategies to DEFEND FORECLOSURES as it was first intended.
    The intelligencia on the subject has left building.
    Now get lost…….

  54. Diane: I remember reading something about 9th circuit and tender. Think I found a link here. I may be entirely wrong, but I think tender is at the discretion of the judge.

  55. It is a fair statement. Thanks

  56. Does anyone know how to get past California “Tender Rule”? Will a Bloomberg Audit showing the Bank was already paid Insurance money going to work in court? If anyone can help me please e mail me at, Thank you so much.

  57. @ Dewayne,

    While I am NOT personally recommending this attorney, someone else posted the guy’s information over on the ‘Find an Attorney” thread here:
    “CHARLES B. “Brad” FRYE
    Attorney and Counselor at Law
    Niels Esperson Building
    808 Travis Street
    Suite 808
    Houston, TX 77002
    Phone: (713) 236-8700 Answered 24 Hours a Day
    Cell: (281) 685-7630
    Fax: (713) 229-8031

    Please do your own due diligence with Attorney Frye. If he is for real, he will understand the need to verify that he is not any type of pretender.

    We have to be vigilant because we already have had false attorneys posted on this site, one example was on here thanks to that certain person, former surgeon Brian Davies.

  58. tnharry, You state this site has officially jumped the shark this week, yet yesterday for no apparent reason you tell Used Kar Guy that you an ex car salesman and then took the bar exam, and he replies, I love you man. Why don’t you grow up and quit attacking Neil on every article he writes. You are intentionally trying to find fault with Neil, and don’t give me this devils advocate bull.

  59. Neil,

    Please keep the articles and editor’s comments coming. They ALL are relevant to our struggle, and I, for one, look forward to reading them.

  60. Can anyone recommend an attorney in Houston Tx, area that understands this mortgage mess as well as Neil.

  61. riots, concentration camps?? this blog has officially jumped the shark this week.

    every day you spend discussing those is a day you’re not educating yourself on your rights and the banks keep winning.

    maybe it’s a slow news week, but useful information has been in short supply on livinglies lately for whatever reason and the commentary has suffered for it in my opinion

  62. P.S. I have a friend that is a State Patrol and he told me he is really worried about the change of things that we are discussing. If hes worried we should be worried and inform people to do massive waves of letters to our politicians that want us asleep while they pilfer and let them know we are awake and voting. VOTING THEM OUT!

  63. Debi P. You are so right! People need to get their heads out of the sand. All the construction workers in the Seattle Tacoma area that are clients, friends and relatives are telling me for the past several years they have been working on these prisons in the Tacoma and Seattle area. One client and friend of ours told me has just finished one in this area and has been asked to go to Alaska to work on three more. I am told they built new warehouses on the flats in Tacoma then built prisons inside the ware houses, and the workers were told the prisons would not be opened for a couple of years. There were 600 less than a year ago now 800 and growing. The most of the construction (shovel ready jobs) are prisons and now some schools. I am told they are everywhere. They are all being built by Halliburton Co. owned by Dick Chaney. Our taxes at work! We must not riot. We must do this intelligently as Neil Garfield and many good souls are doing it. Peaceful protest and pushing for justice and awareness. One thing that I believe can be done is PLEASE EVERYONE SEND THEIR STORY TO ONE HUNDRED TWELFTH CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND GOVERNMENT REFORM, TO ATTENTION ELIJAH E. CUMMINGS, Ranking member. See his seven page letter stating it was his fourth letter in six months to the Honorable Darrell E. Issa Chairman Committee on Oversight and Government Reform U.S. House of Representatives Washington, DC 20515 ; requesting subpoena’s. and write this Honorable? judge to support Elijah E. Cummings. This is a man trying to do justice and we need to send him our story’s and support. Please e-mail President Obama to appoint a recess that was skillfully canceled by the bankster politicians so he can appoint Elizabeth Warren. Look up on the web, (type in Thank God for Elizabeth Warren” and see why we need her.And look up the seven page letter I am talking about above on And has anyone seen Rob McKenna or Chris Greguiore making a stand or a hint of a stand for the Washington families in this state? E-mail them and your local Senators and all Representatives. Let them know we are not asleep, and please send the letters Neil has recommended to the County recorders offices. The letters notifying all carriers they are on notice.

  64. @kathryn thats what my husband said when i was reading the letter to him. all great and dandy he is writing this letter but where was he at the start of this thing with the appraisal fraud why are they continuing foreclosures when it is all fraudulently based on over appraised houses. how do we get the mortitorium we so desparatly need????

  65. YES!!!!! Neil for president i will 2nd it

  66. hi debbi i have an appt with KEL law group next thursday (finally) will call you do you know anything about this group?????

  67. […] Source: Livinglies’s Weblog […]

  68. Neil, the government is trying to invoke riots and civil unrest. See the article where there are over 800 concentration camps in the USA waiting for such disorder. We must do this peacefully or they are ready with FEMA and blackwater –yes the same ones from Iraq to lock us all up and take the keys. Sorry to be the bearer of even further deceit, but to pretend they are not waiting for this is insane and dangerous. I know u r a grand investigator — please investigate this further. This is a crazy world so full of deceit and fraud and theft and rape. We sound more like a third world country everyday. Unfortunately, that’s where we are headed. When the most sacred of laws are disregarded for wall street, why would any of us follow the laws? This is an unprecedented time here in the USA and we need to take a stand with our vote. Are u interested in running for president, by any chance? We need someone with brains and balls and right now we have neither. Thanks for being you and thanks for all you do. This are trying times — u make it easier to deal with all. Bless you- debi 5613899339

  69. 100% Correct and, unfortunately, still far away from hitting the bottom. What a tragedy that this was allowed and even encouraged to happen by all who had any power to put a stop to it.

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