Thoughts on OBL and the Financial Crisis

I am certainly glad to be rid of one more major terrorist and one allegedly involved with killing of almost 3k in America.  What I found curious though, I was searching for 60 Minutes to see if they might have another show on the Foreclosure Mess last night and found Steve Kroft anchoring a program on CNBC which appeared to be a continuation of their look into the foreclosure mess.  He had some interesting interviews but like all programs on this, missed a lot and was reasonably shallow in depth but still added what I thought was more interesting fodder to the “main stream” on these issues.  Was it me, or did it seem to be a “coincidence” that even though OBL had been dead a week, they chose that exact time to make the announcement of OBL being killed?  Probably just me being a conspiracy theorist.  I must say, it really struck me at the timing of this.  Perhaps I’ve been working in this foreclosure stuff too long.  By the way, I can’t find that program on line for some reason…hmmm.  Oh, I know, they had to wait for DNA results to come back.  I guess they just rush in, kill first, confirm who they killed and ask questions later.

Given the “celebrations”  readily shown on television which I personally found distasteful and perpetuating the “ugly American” image, it gave me pause to consider the lack of similar “exuberance” related to what I consider the rape and murder of Americans by the greedy dirt-bags that caused this mortgage and financial crisis and are continuing to take the working lives of Americans (and others).  I decided to run some numbers and came up with this train of thought:  The purported average American lives approximately 78.7 years and the average high school graduate makes $1.2 million in their lifetime.  It is also reported that the credit and foreclosure crisis may cost about $1 trillion (which is VERY low in my opinion).  Even with those numbers, they have taken the lives of over 830,000 Americans!  If you use the $17 trillion of the “financial crisis” instead of the “mortgage crisis” as the number, (which I’d suggest is one and the same) you’re looking at the taking of over 14,000,000 (yes MILLION) working lives of Americans.  While it isn’t the same as actually killing someone, it should give one pause to think about the scope and contrast of what might be considered important enough to “demonstrate” about…

Just one man’s opinion for what it’s worth.

Charles Wayne Cox

28 Responses

  1. Basically, I agree with you. The Pres when acting as commander-in-chief can bask in or take pain in the spotlight of knowing 100% it IS his decision to make. I think it was the easiest decision he has made in his life.


    Al Arabiya with Agencies

    Osama Bin Laden’s house, described by the US government as a $1 million mansion, has been priced by property experts in Pakistan at no more $250,000, The Guardian reports.

    Two property professionals in Abbottabad, the town where Bin Laden was killed last Sunday, said that much of the US government’s description was exaggerated.

    The house was built in 2005 and based on the size of the plot and recent property sales, they estimated that it would fetch no more than the equivalent of $250,000 in the current market.

    After Sunday’s raid by US Navy SEALs which led to the killing of the Al-Qaeda leader, a senior Obama administration official had described the property as an “extraordinarily unique compound” in an “affluent suburb” and valued it at $1 million.

    It later proved that Abbottabad is a quiet, military-dominated town, according to the property experts.

    “This is not a posh area. We call it a middling area,” property dealer Muhammad Anwar, a 22-year-old veteran of the local market, told The Guardian.

    But when reporters reached Abbottabad to see Bin Laden’s hideout, a number of oddities were noticed.

    The compound’s thick, 15-feet-high walls were topped with three tiers of barbed wire, which set the compound apart from the rest of the neighborhood.

    The courtyard surrounding the house was considerably large. Reports indicate that only a handful of people lived inside the compound and so it is unclear what the large space was needed for.

    Meanwhile, census takers had seemingly not visited Bin Laden’s property. Painted on the entrance gate to most homes in the neighborhood was a note in Urdu saying that census enumerators had visited over the past two months. But Bin Laden’s house had no note.

    The households that participate in the census have to give details about everyone who lives there.

    The area Bin Laden lived in was built after the devastating earthquake that hit Pakistan in 2005 and killed more than 73,000 people.

    (Eman El-Shenawi of Al Arabiya can be contacted at

  3. It’s to bad they shot him in the face, I bet his face was blown off, and then they dumped his body at sea. If they knew they were going to bring back the body, why not try to capture him alive? They could have done it. They were not operating in a war zone. The Pakistani military would not have challenged them. It almost seems like just another black flag opt, in support of the 9/11 lie.

    Anybody seen any pictures? I mean the bedroom looked like it was furnished poorly, & the blood stained floor did not impress me. I would think his bedroom would have been furnished nicer. Why no pictures of him laying on the floor? Why dump his body at sea? They say it was because of Islamic law says within 24 hours, “Like we should care, or give a shit about that” and buried facing Mecca, so how does that satisfy Islamic law?
    How will they do DNA comparison? Where/how did they come about having a sample to compare it to?
    They waited a week to time their announcement, and once again left tons of questions.
    I mean I know their murderers, but I fear they may be liars also.
    OBL said after 9/11 that he had nothing to do with it, and Afghanistan said it would turn him over if we would provide proof of his involvement, instead we invaded.
    KSM still awaits trial at Getmo.
    What kind of democratic government holds someone for over 8 years without trial?

  4. Carrie and co.., good lord I’m reliving my past. Cover all yourbases and create a papertrail save everything… Give them
    enough rope… They will hang themselves

  5. Have you seen this? Congressman Alan Grayson back in Sept., ’10. :

    Incredible that this is STILL not in the mainstream…


  6. neidermeyer
    you are 100% correct.. in our country for anyone that ever was entangled in our middle & lower class -the entire scheme is a psychologically crippling & intended as such.
    supporting a family here is a full-on life-time prison sentence with no hope for parol & total violation civil-rights.

  7. Ian. I heard from s reliable source that we hsve a single individual looking at foreclosures at the az atty generals office. We have a massive public interest issue and that’s the response. I know many have written the az atty general I wrote Terry Goddard 5 pages when he was in office , it took almost a year to get a response. I’ve decided they are clueless

  8. Mary_Cochrane
    Regarding ‘annoucement’ and mis-trusting. Anyone notice the resemblance of features (eybrows) nose, mouth, ears, forehead …. of OBL and President obama?
    Scary could he have an unknown brother? or even scarier unknown twin brother!

    hahaha… yea i thought the same thing.
    separated @ birth …. hmmm..


    our gov IS THE terrorists- the entire premise is msm via pentagon arm of msm; creation – all ghosts & rhetoric .
    dont you feel safer NOW?!

  9. tnharry,

    I’m not going to get too technical here but the massive fraud that pulled down (and is continuing to pull down) our economy does kill… Anywhere you look you will see that poverty leads to death…

  10. Michael T Pine with all due respect. Did it the wrong way. He

    The only way out of this is not to convince the Judges first. But to convince the Big Law Firms first.

    The small time Attorneys can team up with the big law firms. There are people in big houses who can afford the bill. Why should they continue to pay into an alleged Scam?

    Do what the citizens of the city of Bell did and go after the City Counsel to dis allow the banks to foreclose and to kick them out of the city (No Business), Or else.


  11. I’m sorry Neil, but I watched 60 minutes last night as I always do and I saw nothing about the foreclosure mess. How do you suppose that is

  12. Here is a comment I found on the LA Times website re. lawyer fighting fraudclosure:

    “I strongly disagree with State Bar Judge Richard Honn in his decision to revoke Michael T Pines license. The State Bar itself needs to be investigated. Why? Because it is part of the reason citizens victimized by Wall St’s egregious trading practices have been further victimized. Many turned to the State Bar and got zero help. Instead they encountered chaos, mis-management of their paperwork, and if ANYTHING they should be revoking the licenses of millions of attys representing the banks. Furthermore, the JUDGES OF THIS COUNTRY have been complicit in refusing to allow lawyers representing the families a/g the banks to put forth their cases by blocking them in a myriad of ways which by default allowed banks to steal homes by the millions. I personally sat in a court where Michael T Pines quoted California Supreme Court ruling, and the sitting Judge said, while waving his hand dramatically in the air, and I quote: “Oh that is the Supreme Court UP THERE.. they can afford to be lofty, we don’t agree with them down here…OVERRULED.” Our mouths fell on the ground… the Judge refused Micheal T Pine’s to be heard on behalf of his client, to follow Supreme Court precedent… this and many other ludicrous rulings by judges clearly Pro-Bank, clearly not interested in having these cases in their courtrooms in the first place, the lying under oath by the Banks’ hired zombies, forced Mr Pines to take the drastic steps he is now being once again punished for. Years from now, I can only hope the truth will come out and Mr Pines will be recognized for trying to fight an impossible battle in a corrupt court system, a corrupt country, a/g Bank Cartels that displaced millions of Americans, causing them great ill health, traumatized their children, and ruined not just our nation, but the global economy.”

    Posted by: enrique marquez | April 28, 2011 at 10:35 PM

  13. Draft of a rant to synthesize thoughts into a cohesive document for all consumers… Can we do this together?

    Is your attorney (BK) or (FC) acting in bad faith?

    What are your rights as consumer while you are under retainer paying an attorney. He is under OATH and has a DUTY in GOOD FAITH to provide legal advice as allowed under law. If an attorney is aware of a crime being committed like the Plaintiff not the party with standing owed the debt what are the Legal Ethics – Ethics’ variable per attorney? What accountability via complaint will they care about that the BAR would sanction them for?

    I learn valuable information all the time thanks to all of you. As I synthesize information a recent actual story of a
    stolen car and what to do forced me to think about all the attorney’s lying ot all of you. And me before I found my current attorney.

    The case of your car is ‘stolen car’, you have the keys, you know where the car is, and you ask your attorney what to do because the police won’t file a criminal report. Why? We don’t care. We care about what the attorney will advise. Is it a a crime for me to get into ‘my car’ with the keys’ and drive it back to my house? What sould I do to protect myself from being arrested if that party claims they are the owner? The Attorney is under oath to advise you should call the police as soon as you get into the car and advise them you are claiming reclaiming your property. Personally, I would go to the police station myself of the town the car is located within and ask for a police escort because who knows what the alleged party who took the car did with it while he had it. Like get tickets.

    The same principles apply regarding an attorney who you are paying under agreement when you ask a questionthat involves law, they are the subject matter expert of law and their duty in good faith to advise you what to do.

    Test your ‘bk’ attorney’s for example. Ask them as a ‘test’ but don’t tell them its a test. DEAR ATTORNEY,
    I need your help. What if my car was stolen and I have the keys and know where the car is. What should I do?
    Then based on their response restate the facts that your property was stolen, and indeed a third party took possession of property in larcenous manner, as Plaintiff attorney’s have filed falsified documents with public offices, and County Clerk/Records including Complaint files, Assignment, lis pendens.

    Dear Attonrey, again, I need your help. During origination of the refinance, helo, mortgage, the attorney’s as settlement agents closed with the banks during the secret origination transactions and the origiantion attorney/settlement agent did allow bank to take my property with intent by deception into wholesale broker/seller of discounted loans, and further, the attorney/settlement agent, title company, appraisal company, intermediary lender, and national bank association, did take possession of my property, and did allow a third party to take possession in a larcenous manner.

    The attorney did conceal for their client accurate business facts, and did not ensure that the property and land records were recorded in accordance with laws and regualtions of the state and federal goverment, UCC domestic and international, and the intent of the substantive omissions of material facts were to hide the intent to place us in harm’s way.

    The substantive omissions of material facts thwarted discovery. The substantive omissions of material facts would not be possible without the attorney/settlement agent withholding accurate business information including documents when presented to consumer were from SERVICER not LENDER.

    The intent of and collusion and collaboration to take property by deception does make the attorney/settlement agent during CLOSING with national bank association a party to be named.

    The documents of this agent/attorney will reveal accurate business statements and facts.

    Fankly, the loan trust documents reveal that the intermediary funder providing funding to agent of the SELLER of the discounted loan who was sold back servicing rights but does not own the note. As a matter of fact according to SEC Regulations, the loan was paid for when converted to a bond sold as certificates. The note was ripped up and connot be scotch taped back together. The agreement of the SELLER of the discounted Loans (as Master Servicer) with the BUYER (Master Servicer) of the loans to be placed into the FWP and PSA are in agreement in the event of a default the SERVICER (SELLER) filed for banks documents taking consumer property by deception.

    We know that the party before the court (FORECLOSURE GATE) October 2008 do steal, cheat, and file falsified documents which the COURT assumes to be TRUE. The BURDEN is on the PLAINTIFF TO PROVE THEY ARE OWED THE DEBT and when they can create any documents they want they can cheat, steal and lie and take possession of your property in larcneous manner.


    Got a BK attorney who is friends with the COURT? GOOD> Make sure you are face to fact, in agrement, pay him money, and ask the following questions:

    Clinet to Attorney:
    If someone stole my car, and I know where the car is, and I can prove its my car, what can I do?
    He should advise you to take the keys, and… what

    If someone stole my property its a theft if I don’t know who the party was and then the police find the property.
    But what if I know who took my property and they are not the lawful owner ( I have both the Title and copy of payments) and the vehicle is registered in my name. The attorney should advise you have the right to reclaim your property and how.
    1st DRAFT – I ramble

    Again Clinet to Attorney:
    The party before the COURT (TRUSTEE) is a national banking association per the former Agreements with Norwest Asset Securities Corp, and as TRUSTEE for the SERVICER not the Loan Trust. The SERVICER in agreements with the MASTER SERVICER BUYER 1st year of loan purchased from SELLER of discounted loans, BUYER sold back SERVICING RIGHTS an din Agreement the SERVICER created documents hanging off of the LOAN TRUST called RECONSTITUION or RECONSTITUTED SERVICING AGREEMENTS through which the SERVICER wil be responsible for bad debt, remaining principal. But the NOTE was destroyed and may not be converted back to a loan instrument. The party before the court created a new loan using the same loan# and is trying to take the property when they already allowed the BUYER to take possession of property in larcenous manner. So what are we to do about all of the party’s filing falsified documents, and evidence we can get that will reveal the broken chain of title, the intent to take property by deception, allowing thrid party to take possession in a larcneous manner, the malfeasonace in civil court what would they be and what case can we file immediatley – what evidence do we need to file immediate a MOTION and reveal to the court documents that will cast shadows over the authenticy of the documents….

    As Attorney now that you know I know the party is stealing the property by lying filing falsified documents with the court, are you going to be liable for the lawsuit when another party comes along, the rightful party if one appears?

    What can we do about the falsified documents signed by attorneys and transactions processed by affiliates of the national bank assocaition, and attorney/settlement agent to get copies of the documents that will reveal accurate business statements and facts which are omitted and are substantive and causing me great harms?
    Are there malfeasonacne we can file with court against the attorney agent/settlement agent? who are responsible for filing documents with the public offices, and that the COURT (JUDGE) of BK will hear any prudent matter that involves unlawful business acts where the ‘senior’ creditor is lying, filed falsifed lis pendes, complaint, assignments, what should I do?



    Copyright (c) 2000 Georgetown Journal of Legal Ethics
    Georgetown Journal of Legal Ethics
    ARTICLE: Should an Attorney be Required to Advise a Client of Adr Options? *

    * This essay is drawn from a discussion paper prepared for the American Bar Association (ABA) Dispute Resolution Section in its discussion of proposals to amend the Model Rules of Professional Conduct. I thank Dean John Feerick and the Honorable Betty Ann Murphy for urging me to till in the vineyard. I thank, as well, Audrey Todd Riescher for indefatigable research assistance in the preparation of this Article.
    Spring, 2000
    13 Geo. J. Legal Ethics 427
    Marshall J. Breger **


    In recent years alternative dispute resolution (“ADR”) has moved from the margins of legal practice into the mainstream. 1 It is no longer the exception for attorneys to employ or clients to request ADR services in almost every aspect of legal representation. 2 This shift to the legal mainstream raises the question whether attorneys, as part of their general obligation to keep clients informed of their legal alternatives, should be required to advise their clients regarding ADR options. This paper will consider this question. In doing so, it will consider, at least inferentially, the character and purpose of ethics “rules.” 3

    Consideration of the issue begins with four relevant Model Rules of Professional Conduct, which is the operative “model” text for state ethics rules. 4

    1) Model Rule 1.2(a) provides that “[a] lawyer shall abide by a client’s decisions concerning the objectives of representation . . . and shall consult with the client as to the means by which they are to be pursued (emphasis added).” 5

    2) Model Rule 1.4(b) provides that “[a] lawyer shall explain a matter to the extent reasonably necessary to permit the client to make informed decisions regarding the representation.” 6

    3) Model Rule 3.2 provides that “[a] lawyer shall make reasonable efforts to expedite litigation consistent with the interests of the client.” 7

    4) Finally, Model Rule 2.1 provides that “in representing a client, a lawyer shall exercise independent professional judgement and render candid advice. In rendering advice, a lawyer …

    If you are interested in obtaining a® ID and Password, please contact us at 1-(800)-227-4908 or visit us at

  14. @ Carrie Becker

    Curious what evidence do you have.

    Do you know the BK attorney?

    Regarding ‘annoucement’ and mis-trusting. Anyone notice the resemblance of features (eybrows) nose, mouth, ears, forehead …. of OBL and President obama?
    Scary could he have an unknown brother? or even scarier unknown twin brother!

  15. tnharry,

    So when a servicer (not lender) , illegally forecloses with NO PROOF that a mortgage even exists, ( won’t go into the securities fraud here), and the homeowner/borrower doesn’t even know about this FRAUD angle, and the homeowner was TOLD BY THE SERVICER that they would qualify for a “loan mod”, but they have to stop paying their mortgage first, and then they foreclose on them behind their back, (while they shred documents over and over and tell you to re-send), and the sheriff comes and kicks them out literally ONTO THE STREET, and the JUDGES DON”T CARE, and the father (who was laid off and can’t get a job because of the financial crisis created by FRAUD from Wall Street/ Banksters), has a heart attack and DIES, and the family is destitute because of all this CRAP—-are you saying there is NO human or civil rights violated there?


  16. They could have gotten Osama Bin Laden (who is irrelevant today) many many years ago.


  17. Brian Davies I think you have an important Court Date tommorow


    Be Strong and Courageous.

  18. In late 2000 or early 2001, the FBI had requested additional funding for the hiring of 5000 (five thousand) additional personnel in order to combat an “alarming rise in mortgage fraud”. And then 9/11 was upon us. One and a half years later, the FBI got 6 (six) additional personnel. And of course the people they did have in their financial crimes unit were reassigned to anti-terrorist duties. So they ended up with a huge net loss of available investigators just as the ponzi scam was gathering steam. And here we are.

  19. C’mon carie – you may have been wronged and may have a good case in fact, but there are no violations of civil and human rights involved. Please know the meaning of words prior to using them…

  20. What did OBL have to do with the financial crisis ? I think he had quite a lot to do with it ,,, 09/11/2001 occurred as we were still recovering from the DOTCOM bust .. For those of you who don’t remember the DOTCOM bubble was a huge deal but it was limited for the most part in scope to normal financial fallout among tech related companies, if you weren’t in the affected stocks or just moved to the sidelines you were OK …

    Wall Street was sick and they had a small game going on which some players had juiced up to pay far more than the normal fee structure on creating a deal … They had found how to collect Neils infamous Tier 2 YSP ,, They had also discovered that they were geniuses .. true geniuses … They could simply fuel the trading with easy credit FOREVER and nobody would ever know because nobody would investigate because EVERYBODY was happy… Best of all the government was sanctioning the “easy money , everyone needs to own a home” mantra as they saw home ownership as fueling purchases of home furnishings and much more juicing the entire economy … If you were ever in car sales you know when you have someone who walks on your lot that bought a home in the last 6 months you HAVE A BUYER (mostly because people have put off buying in favor of saving for a while in order to buy a house)

    Quite simply everyone saw the benefits and didn’t know how to shut off the spigot when things got out of control… Osama bin Laden’s attack on the WTC came at just the right time to light the fuse on the problem,, it probably would have happened anyway but maybe slower and in a more controlled fashion,, maybe it would have been stopped while we could still “fix” the problem with a 10 year recession instead of a depression (and our buddy Bernanke chose the depression route by propping up his TBTF buddies instead of cutting out the infection).

    Blaming Wall Street is accurate and easy,, they broke all the rules in a mad rush to enslave us all … but saying that is like blaming a Lion for Tiger for killing too many prey animals .. The problem really boils down to the FEDS NEED FOR INFLATION and the incestuous relationship having a public/private FED as go between between the regulators and the regulated and the way that effectively eliminated regulation.

  21. @ Carrie Bekker

    Congratulations on what sounds like a successful lawsuit—if you don’t mind me asking—how did you do it?

    I am about to call a BK attorney to see if I can get my mortgage declared “unsecured” and discharged, due to the servicer’s inability to prove not only who owns the mortgage, but even if a mortgage still exists!
    The servicer (IndyMac) is trying to extort money from me on a bogus “trial plan” for an eventual “loan mod”. A loan mod for a mortgage that doesn’t even exist? I don’t think so…

  22. Neil, I had the same reaction. Gee, how handy that Bin Laden is dead now. The announcement was made when they wanted to make it. They’ve probably known where he was for a while but wanted to wait until the “timing was right.” What better timing than Obama’s re-election campaign which he kicked off not too much earlier than the Bin Laden announcement. It’s also a diversion tactic. Gee, the economy isn’t recovering like we thought it would and gee, we still have to kick out all these homeowners, and gee, now we have all these homeless people, some of whom lost their jobs because they have no permanent place to live, much less take a shower and look presentable. BUT now that Bin Laden is dead, everything is going to be OK and now the economy will recover. What a bunch of hooey. I’ve really lost faith in this country, in our government, and most certainly the financial sector, especially banks. We’ve been living in a cheap motel for over a month now, after the Sheriff came to escort us out of our home. Our costs have skyrocketed because now we’re paying a daily room rate (it’s inexpensive, but it still adds up when you’re self employed and have a husband whose job doesn’t pay much) plus gigantic storage bills because we had to move very quickly so that we wouldn’t lose everything we owned. Yet we don’t qualify for aid, like food stamps, because my husband makes $5,000 over the annual threshold. This country just makes me sick; it’s mutated from the US I used to know and love. Fortunately for us, we sued the bank and all the other parties and, when all is said and done, we stand to get substantial money damages and get our home back too, now that they can’t sell it, rent it or show it because it’s now tied up in court. If we’re lucky, there will be some sort of “happy ending” for us and, after that, we’ll probably pick up and leave this corrupt country for good.

  23. This article states that no one has been “killed” by the financial crisis…I beg to differ…
    We have no statistics on the amount of traumatized homeowners (and their children), who have had heart attacks, panic attacks, PTSD issues, and a variety of other stress related issues, which HAVE INDEED led to deaths…
    It’s just not being reported…of course.


    A giant con game was perpetrated on the American homeowner (among others), and the victims as yet are still unaware, HAVE NO VOICE, and the perpetrators are still getting away with their crimes…

    How much longer? What can we do?

  24. The IRS was well aware of this all along!

    To me it’s more window dressing.

  25. How insightful of you, thank you for pointing out to the fact that some more important things that affect us directly is going unnoticed, and played down. I wonder if the housing crisis and the total scamming and fraud inflicted upon the American public was continuously televised would it get the the people to raise their voices? I like you, wonder why this time was chosen to make such announcement, what is being covered up this time. OBL is gone I hope it’s true, and any evilness that caused harm to humanity should be rid off, any crime including those committed by too big to follow the rules entities should also be addressed harshly. We need more friends in the media perhaps, to make an impact…

  26. […] Source: Livinglies’s Weblog […]

  27. maybe we could apply this argument in the court, like bin laden was killed by u.s. team elite, but they have to conduct DNA to make sure it was Bin Ladin who was killed? usually, the pretender lenders would stop the plaintiffs from doing discovery for their fraudulent activities such as the fabricated documentation and robo-signers, if not given that opportunity to conduct discovery then there is no way we could prove that there were frauds on the part of the pretender lenders? to determined that it was indeed bin laden that was killed through DNA testing then i guessed we could argue to the court that discovery is very important to prove fraud. my opinion discovery = DNA without such DNA testing, the govt. cannot claim victory against al queda.

  28. Not on topic as far as OBL is concerned, but Neil, I think this story is worthy of your attention:

    (Reuters) – The Internal Revenue Service has launched a review of the tax-exempt status of a widely-held form of mortgage-backed securities called REMICs.

    The IRS confirmed to Reuters that the review comes in response to mounting evidence that banks violated tax requirements by mishandling the transfer of mortgages to REMICs, short for Real Estate Mortgage Conduits.

    Should the IRS find reason to take tough action, the financial impact could be enormous. REMIC investments are held by pension funds, in individual retirement plans such as 401(k)s and by state and local government entities.

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