WOW! I guess I hit a nerve. Here is an example of the many comments received. Worth the read not only because it validates what we know, but proposes action.

CAUTION: I agree that freedom of assembly and free speech is probably going to have more effect than any traditional approach. But we are close to a tinderbox here with millions of people out of work, underemployed, and simply dropped out that could lead to a chaos that none of us should want or allow. The anger and frustration is growing. Power in the people is reserved to those who maintain the higher moral ground. Scaring people with violence or threats will isolate you even if it gets you some press coverage.

So my advice is don’t break any laws, and if you are given a direct instruction from law enforcement, obey the command unless you are prepared to be arrested or detained. If so, go peacefully. Take no action against law enforcement officers. They are not the cause of the problem and you will alienate people who might otherwise sympathize with your views.

Essentially, this is what will happen in court. The foreclosure mills justify their conscience because they are simply doing what they are paid to do. Pro-se litigants have a personal hook in the deal – the foreclosure mills have nothing but easy money.

We started filing our lawsuit long before we stopped paying the mortgage. In fact, it was “after” we sent the demand letter with complaint attached to the builder and original lender when they filed to foreclose.

We were left in a no-win situation because of what the BANK – BUILDER – APPRAISER – County Code Official – conspired and did. We cannot fix, correct, or sell our house because of their actions. It has cost us everything which is exactly the position the foreclosure mills want their prey to be in. Unfortunately, they filed false affidavits and committed fraud on the court. The judge dismissed the case without prejudice which means they will be back.

My outrage and infuriation is that they ALL know it. The alleged original lender knew they pre-sold our loan so their liability was already limited at best. We paid the full mortgage for 8-months before moving into the house. That alone is a violation of the PSA. The house violates the zoning & building codes – another violation. IMHO – I do believe the mortgage loan – Instrument is VOID & Nullified because at NO-TIME was it EVER a legitimate legal Instrument. It is still isn’t…

The idiocy of attempting to work this out legally – respectfully is futile because they have NO INTENTION of working anything out. Their intentions are clear – pound us into poverty – take the property – sue us for whatever else defiency or whatever and leave us for dead…

Yet, at no-time did we participate with their lies & deception.

I specifically gave Patrick countless proof that CW deliberately sold mortgages to consumers that did NOT know what they were getting. Yet, he believes these people are accepting their due-responsibility. How can they accept responsibility for something they have no-idea was done – worse it was done TO THEM and NOT the lender. That is hypocrisy on Patrick’s part. Yet, he will conveniently drop back to the courts continued mis-handling of these cases and proclaim victory.

I agree with Frankielee – the fact of the matter is everyone should stop paying their loans and drive the lenders into bankruptcy. It would not take every loan – maybe 4-6 months and these lending institutions would collapse. Sadly, that will not happen because these lenders control the media which portrays every borrower in trouble as a deadbeat. Strangely, when I think back to a few weeks before settlement – I kept asking – don’t they need a U&O Permit – what about the lien waivers – invoices – how could they get a final inspection and appraisal to settle on a house that was NOT completed..? I was told it was all taken-care-of… hmm?

I know of folks who were never late paying their mortgage and they were foreclosed. As for us – we simply attempted to sue the original lender so we could fix the house, correct the zoning – illegal U&O – lack of inspections – etc and just sell the damn place. The made it very clear – they will stomp us into submission – take the house – wash the title through the foreclosure process – pay for the illegalities using the special hazard insurance (Ins fraud) and auction for pretty penny pocketing the entire deal as another cash-cow for them.

…and somehow the guilt manipulators want me to feel as though it was my-fault…

All I know anymore is this driving me insane – I wake up several times per night with them on my mind and none of it is good. Gee maybe I can sue them for punitive damages for driving me crazy but do I have to [suggestion omitted) to do it…? It certainly appears that way…

42 Responses

  1. When the payments are made to the court, then the court benefits from the interest accrued on the monies held–instead of the “lender.”

    This factor, coupled with the fact that the court is now “trustee” of your payments, should discourage negative credit reporting because the same court that is trustee of your payments is the same court that can assess damages against the “lender” for negative credit reporting.

    Also, when the “lender” claims that payments are not being made, they are discounting the authority of the court and basically accusing the court of being delinquent since the court is acting as trustee for the funds…

  2. Angela,
    My attorney is suggesting just that along with asking for accounting papers BEFORE you go into default. Bring the onus onto the pretender lender to show who you owe. And do it under the guise of wanting to know who to pay. It will show incredible hubris of the PL, when you show up in court with an escrow balance of $25,000 and the PL STILL won’t disclose documents. The judge will be aware immediately that there is something fishy in this transaction. The PL cannot disclose the accounting or they expose themselves as frauds, and the expose will only take them to jail. They won’t do it. And the homeowner then has reason to take the house……as the PL cannot prove standing.


  3. I highly recommend all of you register on Foreclosure Hamlet. I want to get people organized and the leader of this website is doing just that.

    At the beginning of last week, I knew of two people who were going through this in Washington. NOW, my numbers are growing to double digits. When we get everyone organized is only when we will begin to win. We need to start making some noise and telling the media that this foreclosure story is NOT old news….but only beginning.

    Start organizing people in your area. Let’s make this orgnanizing go viral and begin to talk to each other across the country so that we can begin to protest TOGETHER ACROSS THE COUNTRY!!! Let’s make some noise, people!!!


  4. Hi Angella,

    Wow – great idea and very well written…

    I wonder what the courts would think…? My goal would be to starve the lenders into submission…making them devulge their documents – including the inflated appraisals etc – so hopefully folks can see what was done – make appropriate balance adjustments and at least put the system back to some-sort-of reset.

    IMHO – the lenders should be FORCED to re-write the loans to whatever the borrower can now afford. If they can only afford 50k and had a 350k mortgage – TOUGH the lender EATS the difference – THEN the borrower pays the FED (court) their new mortgage payment. Some day when the borrower sells the property maybe 50% of the profits at time of sale could be deposited into a separate account to that helps others as well. This removes the criminal lenders – keeps folks in their homes – no more damn bailouts…

    Just my thoughts – and again – great idea Angella and well written… I wish I could write as well as some here…

  5. Angella, you wrote:

    “Also…How can the “lender” continually report late payments on your credit report when the payments are being made to the court itself? I don’t think that this would reflect well on the “lender,” especially in the fact that the Fair Credit Reporting Act does not permit a “creditor” to report negative payment history when the payment is the subject of a legitimate dispute.”

    You’re right that the Fair Credit Reporting act, as well as RESPA don’t “permit” these acts, but the lenders are acting with complete impunity in these regards. Not only are they ignoring repeated qualified written requests, that, I would add, are asking legitimate questions concerning incorrect accounting on my loan, (BofA and Wells) but they’re continually slamming my credit report. But what do they have to fear? Am I, a loser homeowner with no funds left, going to threaten them with legal action over a $1000 enforcement fine? They know the AG’s don’t come after them for these infractions. They know they own the system. 100% impunity and indifference.

  6. In response to David’s comments about withholding payments so that these corrupt institutions will collapse…

    I believe there to be a better way than completely stopping payments that would serve a similar capacity.

    That would be to make payments to a court registry versus to the “lender.” By making payments–including escrow–to the court registry, a homeowner would be acting in good faith until the case resolves–even if the case involves standing. The dispute is not the existence of an obligation entered into by the homeowner, but rather, whether or not that obligation has been paid by a third party, or whether the party pursuing foreclosure has actual standing to foreclose…

    Payment to the court registry would serve to remove any “unjust enrichment” of either party while the foreclosure is being contested–the homeowner would be making payments and the “lender” would not be receiving payments for principal, interest, or most importantly–for escrow. Even if the “lender” in question would not suffer any loss by not receiving payments on something that was never owed to them in the first place, that “lender” would still be obligated to make regular payments for the escrow items even though they were not receiving escrow payments from the homeowner…

    Also…How can the “lender” continually report late payments on your credit report when the payments are being made to the court itself? I don’t think that this would reflect well on the “lender,” especially in the fact that the Fair Credit Reporting Act does not permit a “creditor” to report negative payment history when the payment is the subject of a legitimate dispute. And how more legitimate can it get than with a court of law?

    Just my thoughts…I was granted a temporary injunction close to two years ago and subsequently have been making payments (although the amount of which is in dispute…) into the court registry and feel that doing so prevents underhanded tactics by the “lender,” while at the same time exhibiting the good faith cooperation of the homeowner…

  7. Hi Jose,

    Though I appreciate the zeal – protesting – is entertainment to these people. These foreclosure mills turned off their conscience years ago. To them – its merely their job – its unfortunate but someone has to do it… that’s how they think… Sadly, the judges have been drinking from the same fountain…

    None of this matters to them as you mentioned their kids don’t see many of us bottom-feeders – they all go to private schools…

    I’m in MD but no energy for something like that anymore – I’d rather drive the McVeigh U-Hauler and leave a crater the size of 5-football fields about 100 ft deep… then send the video to the remaining foreclosure mills as a pleasent reminder. Just send it out with a simple question – is it worth it…? then at the end of the video repeat – is it really worth it..? your move…?

    Maybe that’s too far-gone for some – man, I’m tired of the bs – we’ve been fighting these lying bastards since 2003. Their teflon suits work in court – so, lets find out if they work outside court.

    Protest – ANGRY PROTESTS at their HOMES – follow them to work – follow them to church – following them to school – NOW THAT MIGHT have some interest… but I’d surely get into trouble getting that close these scum… These people are 100% certified terrorists in my book… there is only ONE thing to do with a terrorist…

    Ironically, that is their game – wear down the borrowers & grind them into the dirt until there is nothing left… I will surely congratulate them on a job well done – but then the inevitable question will follow – was it worth it… was it really worth it…? hmm?

  8. Correct me if I am wrong – if the FED bought all these debt, they should be the ones foreclosing on us ?

    Fed, Citing Slowdown, to Buy U.S. Debt

    In buying new Treasury securities to the tune of about $10 billion a month — a small fraction of the roughly $700 billion in Treasury debt sitting on the Fed’s balance sheet — the Fed will not let the balance sheet shrink for the time being.

    The Fed bought $1.25 trillion in mortgage-backed securities, and another $200 billion in debts owed by government-sponsored enterprises, primarily Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and completed the purchases in March.

  9. We need to set it up, we may call it FORECLOSURES ARE US PAC.

  10. We need to create a PAC, Political Action Committee. We need to get the politicians to kiss our rear ends for a change.

  11. Let us start right now, we are running out of time. The crooks keep piling on profits, they are sending their kids to private school and you get the raw deal.

    I am up for working your rear off and getting what your mind, will, education and opportunities afford you, however, they did act behind our backs. They created a double headed ILLEGAL pyramid scheme, they got bailed out, and all we got offered was CALL THEM THEY WILL HELP!, BULL CRAP.

    WE need to act, we need to get together, we need to have meetings , we NEED to get in the news.

    We need to tell the world our truth and see how many judges will face reelection against millions of us who are PISSED!

    How many congress people bent over for the banksters and they just flipped the finger at us.

    I am so mad. I see people walking the aisles of the local supermarket just thinking how they may afford to feed their kids today. I am not asking for fairness, that is an utopia. I am demanding justice. What if the whole system is rigged, what if that is the way theu have been doing it. Well it is wrong.

    When are we going to decide to change the status quo.


  12. If any one is open to start the protest at the local court houses, letting everyone present, the clerks, the recording officers, the sheriff, that the whole foreclosure process is a scam on us and on the citizenry, I up for game.

    email me your interest and we should get organized

    for those in VA, DC and MD

    I can call a couple of people I know at the Washington Post and see what comes out of this. We need to start the fight from the streets and the on the voting booths

  13. FYI

    This is big news…

    August 10, 2010
    Media Contact: Sandi Copes
    Phone: (850) 245-0150

    Florida Law Firms Subpoenaed Over Foreclosure Filing Practices

    TALLAHASSEE, FL – Attorney General Bill McCollum today announced his office has launched three new investigations into allegations of unfair and deceptive actions by Florida law firms handling foreclosure cases. The Attorney General’s Economic Crimes Division is investigating whether improper documentation may have been created and filed with Florida courts to speed up foreclosure processes, potentially without the knowledge or consent of the homeowners involved.

    The new investigations name The Law Offices of Marshall C. Watson, P.A.; Shapiro & Fishman, LLP; and the Law Offices of David J. Stern, P.A. The law firms were hired by loan servicers to begin foreclosure proceedings when consumers were in arrears on their mortgages.

    Because many mortgages have been bought and sold by different institutions multiple times, key paperwork involved in the process to obtain foreclosure judgments is often missing. On numerous occasions, allegedly fabricated documents have been presented to the courts in foreclosure actions to obtain final judgments against homeowners. Thousands of final judgments of foreclosure against Florida homeowners may have been the result of the allegedly improper actions of the law firms under investigation.

    The Attorney General’s Office is also investigating whether the law firms have created affiliated companies outside the United States where the allegedly false documents are being prepared and then submitted to the law firms for use.

    Subpoenas have been served on each of the law firms listed above, and the investigations are ongoing.

  14. Folks, here’s the problem. From the NY Times today:

    “During the bubble years, many Wall Street banks built a lucrative business packaging home mortgages into bonds and other investments.”

    I didn’t agree to this practice. Did you? Was it ever revealed that your home was being turned into a slot machine token for fat cats on Wall street?

    Also from the Times today:

    “Publicly, banks vastly underestimated their exposure to the dangerous mortgage investments they were creating.”

    Dangerous mortgage investments? Our homes? Why weren’t we told that our homes were potential dangerous investments? Why did I continue to receive offers to refi for an additional quarter million dollars cash out while I was being foreclosed on by the same banking institution, if there was even the slightest risk that the roof over my head was potentially risky?

    How did they come to the power of securitization of our homes, without our knowledge or without our approval? Isn’t that like selling you a car and then selling it to your neighbor as well? And don’t forget that all the while they’ve taken out an insurance policy against the car, hoping to hit a payday if either of us wrecks. Which by the way we did.

    I didn’t sign up for this. Did you?

  15. @BSE
    I would like to try to get everyone organized, but I need cooperation. I have sent my email address and phone number on this site a zillion times, but here it goes again.


    Let’s get ORGANIZED! We need all of us to start responding!!!

  16. Edge,

    Without a doubt – separating my principles (belief) from the clinical courtroom is key.

    I tend to be someone “compelled” to stand up when something is wrong. It is unconscionable to do otherwise. I know there are a smart ways and a wrong ways – but I know myself enough that it will eventually get me into trouble on a courtroom floor.

    These foreclosure mills are professional liars – it is their job to do whatever necessary to win – it does not matter how or the consequences to others. That is the very essence of what is going on. The foreclosure mills know already – that their client is lying and has committed multiple illegalities – and if they had any integrity at all they would be attempting to negotiate a decent outcome for both.

    However, it is their position that they don’t need to because they own the courts and can simply stomp the borrower into the dirt – proving their superiority – then tag team them a little making sure the borrower got the message… and that is exactly why once my foot is on their throat they are NOT getting back up – no crying uncle – no settlement – at that point – it’s a death match. They are not putting my wife & I through all this bs – then think for 5-minutes they will simply pull back and barter their way out of it. NOTTA – freaking chance in hell…

    I wish we could find a lawyer with the tenacity & disposition of a junkyard dog. Just unleash them and let the blood-fest begin…

    We are tired of all the bs. As mentioned previously, I filled Attorney Grievances against the foreclosure mill for filing false affidavits. I believe we easily have a case for violating the Fair Debt Collections – undoubtedly Mortgage Fraud – Breach of Contract – etc but putting all that down in a complaint that will not get trumped by some courtroom politics or procedure – or stating a wrong claim or whatever – man, I would go bullistic. I won’t show it there – but at this stage – 51-yrs old loss of our 100k salary the sale of our business – and whatever else they’ll undoubtedly pile on – I’ll be calling the Hamas hotline for the biggest vest I can stradle… a one-way ticket to – hey remember me… CLICK!!! Yep sounds crazy but the big problem is – to these foreclosure mills it’s just another day on the job. They don’t care about us or anyone else. This is nothing but a meal ticket and easy money for them. if it takes 2-3 years – so what, they get paid anyway. The hell they put the families through is not their problem. Well, THAT is the PROBLEM – until folks MAKE IT THEIR problem it will not change.

    If we win and the were forced to write us a check for 10 million bucks, you know as I do, that is PEANUTS to them. So, what they lost one case – they make that up within such a short time – it simply does not matter. Maybe if 20-30 families busted the same foreclosure mill it might help change things but the reality is – until they realize their entire FAMILIES are at risk – they have no incentive to change.

    While blogg – these major law firms have their lobbyist helping re-write the laws to make sure we cannot win – no matter what we do. They are changing laws everyday as we speak to get around these issues.

  17. Alina wrote:

    “They pocketed our money, turned around and are lending the money back to us at 4% interest.”

    Actually, another problem I didn’t mention is that they have conveniently set up a system whereby if they don’t like you, or if you failed them somehow, they can disaprove you. FICO! I was recently refused opening a checking account because of FICO. I’ve been a businessman for 40 years now. When applying for a checking account, the sweet old lady taking the application said it would just be a monent, she was off to make copies. She returned and said sorry, you’ve been refused due to your credit score. WTF? I’ve always had perfect credit.

    The system is totally gamed. As I’ve said before, they have all of the shiney red hotels, from St. Charles Place to Boardwalk. And at any time you may pick the card “bank error, pay $300,000.” Or even, “go directly to jail!”

    It;s totally gamed. Broken. Humpty Dumpty.

  18. my situation is much the same. I was fine in my humble home my credit score was high, my life was balanced, “the deal” had me pledge my then home to build the home i just had taken also…i was brave, i am brave i chose to stand up and fight but as one person once said all i have is head of lettuce banging on the castle doors because of the conscious denial by the courts to my due process and rights under the consitution! could anything be worse?. Blogger Gwen i like your approach, but you have the knowledge and level headedness to move your case. I am so angry in scared i might wack someone with myproverbial head of lettuce! Im still in the game my lawsuit lives thanks to my new (3rd) attorney. the next few weeks will be crucial. Im in Arizona so its tough.Im simply holding on to truth in the hope it will prevail, eventually. If Money is the root of all evils, its here special delivered by goldman sacs and their prostitutes.The time WILL come when they will be held to account (emphasis added!) not in dollars but Karma., so HOW DO WE STOP THE BELIEVER SYNDROME THAT THINGS ARE ALL ROSY IN THE GARDEN HOW DO WE GET EVERYONE TO STOP PAYING THEIR MORTGAGE AND GET THE MESSAGE ACROSS TO THE PERPETRATORSTHAT WHAT HAS GONE DOWN IS A BAD WAY AND WE WILL NOT DO WE WILL NOT GO ALONG LIKE THE CHILDREN THAT FOLLOWED THE PIED PIPER

  19. I believe in JAIL OUT not a BAIL OUT for the sheisters that got into this mess. They played with our lives and our futures.

    Now, because they had to bailed out, our children’s futures are at risk. We gave these bozos our hard earned money with zero percent interest in exchange for them helping struggling homeowners. They pocketed our money, turned around and are lending the money back to us at 4% interest. They bet against us, orchestrated the largest Ponzi scheme ever in the history of the world and yet they get millions of dollars in bonuses.

    If we did this, we would be in jail by now. Why aren’t they?

  20. Alina,

    I remember well all of the TV money pundits, as well as government folks, saying to “call your lender, they want to help you. Really, they don’t want your house.”

    Yeah, right! Nine months I spent on the phone and faxing, only to be modified upwards. What a joke. Countrywide = Countryfried!

    Fast forward….I haven’t made a payment in 2 1/2 years, and I receive nothing from BOA. They don’t send notices, statements, nothing. They ignore multiple QWR’s. Why? Because if they let the world know of just how many of us there are out there….people who have been so totally screwed, and are still in the pipeline, awaiting destitution, there would be an uproar.

    If the truth was widely known and reported, that there are nearly 60,000 Americans each week being placed on the curb like so much garbage, by institutions that are not only propped up by the United States government, that they wouldn’t even be here if it weren’t for us, the taxpayers. And yet, these same institutions are given complete control of the housing debacle, given the keys to the courtrooms and to the judges backrooms. They, the bankers, are in control of the mortgage debacle and it’s solution. And what exactly is their solution to this problem? To very slowly take away all of the houses that they sold us fraudulently. While the fed and the treasury, the legislative and judicial look the other way, and while Obama talks the talk and pretends that none of this is happening.

    It is a total disgrace. My wife and I are nearing our 60’s, and have had everything taken from us. There’s nothing left whatsoever. And if that wasn’t enough, we have no way of making any money, as the depression has voided any possibility of employment in our lifelong occupations. Wards of the state? Cardboard housing? Life under a bridge? Are we still in America? Or should it be called the United States of Corporate America from now on?

    And to think I have to explain over and over to the IRS that there’s nothing left for them. No, I have no 401k. I promise you. No, I have no relatives that I can borrow from, I promise. No, I haven’t any work, I assure you. An extension? Whatever!

    “There’s no capacity to regulate or punish them [banks] because they’re too big to be threatened with failure.” says Jack Blum, a U.S. Senate investigator for 14 years and a consultant to international banks and brokerage firms.

    So what is one to do? Surely not what David is discussing. David, although I feel your pain, your loose talk just might sink the ship, or in this case this fine and much needed website, as you just can’t talk such violence in a public forum. I’m truly sorry about your plight and wish I had the answers.

    So what can be done? I’m open to any suggestions. But I still don’t have a clue of what a constructive form of action looks like.

    From my viewpoint, life has become a swirling, sucking eddy of despair, filled with brief moments of false hope, in an ever expanding universe. Does anyone have a solution? A cure? I’m all ears.

  21. Tuesday 10 August 2010


    You may not understand courtroom procedures, as you say, but you have clearly articulated as good an understanding of the legal system as one can expect.

    The problem is most people have “beliefs” about HOW things are SUPPOSED to work, as people are accustomed to interacting with others. But courts function from a purely legal way, based on procedures that DO NOT reflect the BELIEFS most people have about the way things are expected to work as people have experienced in their daily lives.

    Who made the rules? Lawyers. Who created the procedures to be followed in court? Lawyers. What are judges? Former lawyers. You are right. One cannot “expect” fairness and justice in a court of law.
    One has to fight and demand their just due, using the same rules of court.

    The BAR is a closed-end club, reserved for members only. Pro se’s need not apply.

    You understand how things work, David. The difficulty derives from being unable to reconcile beliefs held v the way things work in a courtroom environment. You would do well to remove the emotional element of your beliefs and learn that you are up against a well-oiled business that could care less about how you FEEL and what you BELIEVE.

    It is these feelings and beliefs that keep people hot and bothered against the cool and calm of “procedures” steamrolling over one’s emotions.

    You are a bright individual. The learning curve flattens out once one learns how to present pleadings. The other side is not as bright. They just control the system with an edge. They can be beaten, and the information gleaned from tis and other sites provides a light in the darkness.

    Thanks for taking the time to post.

  22. TO ALINA

    Please let me know how to contact you. I have just sold my house via short sale, but am now working to clear my credit from the late payments BofA and Chase have reported. I would very much appreciate discussing how you disputed the servicers reporting to the CRA’s. Thank you very much!

  23. One more thing I want to add is that I started this odyssey in the summer of 2007 after my husband was laid off and then shortly afterwards suffered a heart attack. I was not behind in my mortgage payments and did not want to get behind so I contacted the servicer. At that time, there was scant information regarding modifications or anything else for that matter. The President had gone on TV to tell people that if they thought they would have a problem paying their mortgage then they should contact their bank because the banks would work with them. This message was broadcast on all airwaves.

    After nine months of being lied to, I realized that the servicer had no intent of dealing with me honestly and failry. This is all I wanted – I was not looking to get a house for free – I just needed a litte help so that I would not fall behind on my mortgage payments.

    The servicer repeatedly lied and that’s when I started my research, I had no idea that the loan originator had swindled my husband and me. It was only after examining the documents that I found the violations. So, I went on the offensive.

    My goal was simply to force the servicer to deal with me honestly and fairly – nothing more, nothing less. The servicer, throught their repeated lies, is the one that placed itself in an untenable position. I just took their lies and threw them back in their face.

  24. Hi Edge,

    I appreciate the comments and I have no-issue with hard questions. This stuff is difficult and asking hard questions – doing some weeding is necessary. I am not perfect – don’t claim to be the brightest bulb on the tree and in fact did not graduate high-school. However, we have always worked hard, paid our bills on time, and are honest. The SHOCK ‘N AWE of this ordeal is the learning curve that NONE OF IT has ANYTHING to do with JUSTICE – RIGHT or WRONG – FAIRNESS – or even LAW (as most folks understand law). That’s the part that literally blows-my-mind… This is not about justice and our courts are not concerned with justice. This is about who has the biggest subscription to Lexis-Nexis – Thomas Law and makes the contribution cash-registers ka-ching. It is alarming. But for the rarest of occasions – law is futile – justice denied – presentation undeliverable.

    My biggest problem – speaking for “me” – I have no idea HOW a courtroom works and I honestly cannot get-a-grip of it. When something is wrong – it is wrong. I’m not making excuses for myself – I simply do not know how or what to do and I do not have the capability to learn all the applicable laws – put them into a presentable methodical linear layout that fits within the courtroom politics.

    I would like to answer your comments

    [Edge wrote] A more effective tactic is to learn how to present a pleading that will stop the other side.

    The learning curve is very, very, steep. I’ve read 100s of cases. Many have lost simply because the other side knows how to dance better for the judge. Consequently, the pro-se litigant is left naked – useless – and without any answers. The foreclosure mill walks away – “another one bites the dust” while the homeowners are broken & confused.

    [Edge wrote] – Trust me, the other side, and that includes judges, are far more organized and formidable than the “people.”

    AMEN & AMEN – they have this down to a science. In fact, we have all been PROFILED before we’ve walked into the courtroom. They know what we will say – how we will say it. If by any chance we surprise them – THEY are ready to quickly get that judge back on THEIR TRACK so mitigate any chance to give that judge a reason to listen to the other side. They are diligent about keeping it hyper-focused on the deadbeats are not paying – as they did, after all, sign a Promise to Pay…

    [Edge wrote]
    (David)“Yet, at no-time did we participate with their lies & deception.”
    (Edge’s Response) Not intentionally, and certainly not knowingly, but anyone who signed for a note did participate. Lies and deception? That is how one makes challenges in pleadings, exposing the lies, deception and fraud.
    —-end snip —-

    As a “generalization”, I agree with you. However, my response to the signatures would – those signatures merely represent the Fraudulent Inducement we were subjected to judge… Those are NOT our legal signatures – those signatures are FRAUDS. I have the proof – but I am concerned of exposing it all here because I am sure that foreclosure mill has their minions READING these websites regularly and taking notes.

    So, at no time did we participate with their lies & deception and in fact I told the lender flat-out – there was no way in hell we could sustain that loan for very loan. It was absurd. Then why did we sign the docs – answer – because we had NO CHOICE – we already had over 300k tied up in the property. The builder embezzled approx 100k – we were already preparing to sue the builder – finish the house then sell it. What we did NOT know was the lender used a Fraudulent U&O PERMIT – we did NOT KNOW the inspections were NEVER Corrected – etc… This literally – legally means – that we cannot sell the house without disclosing the baggage & illegalities – we cannot fix it because no builder can get a permit to complete or fix the screwed up mess. There is absolutely NO-WAY I would have signed a million dollar loan for something like this and certainly would not have signed the loan if the lender told me they already SOLD our mortgage because we had zero leverage over the builder without the lender. A crack-head should be able to see that so MY HOPE (PLEA) is that a JUDGE will see it. My problem as mentioned, I do NOT know how to present it properly so a judge could hear it within their courtroom politics.

    The lender made a “special deal” with THEIR builder – he would finish the house no-later than 30-days after settlement. So, we agreed. However, that damn lender ALREADY sold the Note to Countrywide OR I believe Countrywide FINANCED the ENTIRE ordeal and there was no supposed Original Lender – Countrywide WAS/IS the lender the whole-time. But-still, what else would someone do walk away and lose 300+k on their dream house. This was where we planned to retire. I drew the plans – we were done. The business was about to be sold for 1.3 million bucks – had a deposit check for the deal. We were about to finally get our lives back. The lender would not allow us to sell the business until construction was completed – THEN – they warned me if I terminated their builder – they could foreclose and we would have to find another PRE-APPROVED builder and finish the house with or without the alleged missing 100k. Ironically, now knowing the house was never even inspected from footer to final – it would have been impossible to find another builder. I also found out this same builder had trouble with ANOTHER couple and GUESS WHO THAT LENDER WAS… AND that couple busted that builder for several 100k at which the SAME TIME I was hollering at our lender (the SAME lender) that we were missing 100k and guess WHO helped arbitrate that deal – THAT FREAKING LENDER! Then I found out THAT LENDER loaned their builder 520k and the county code official 247k at the SAME TIME they gave the LENDER the FRAUDULENT U&O PERMIT… Gee does that sound like a favor or what… and I’m just getting started… If there is an attorney here reading it – WE NEED ONE..

    I have PROOF – material evidence supporting EVERYTHING above. In fact, while building the builder’s wife was breaking into our home and stealing our prescription medication – which is also on VIDEO… and I sent the damn VIDEO to the lender…

    Those are only glimpses of what we’ve fighting. Edge, I appreciate your comments. I honestly do not know how to handle a courtroom. My brains are so damn fried anymore – I’d rather shoot the bastards and their kids – then stand there and ask them NOW was it worth it you dumb bastard – was it really worth the lives of your wife & kids – was it really worth it.

    I know that sounds crazy but I am tired of the bs and lies by these punks. There is no way in hell I will settle for anything less than what my wife & I are due. They have stolen our lives. I was told maybe we’d get a few-100k – I got up and told them point-blank – write the check out to Osama Bin Laden because for that kind-of bs money – that’s exactly what I’ll do with it. I am sorry but for what they’ve done to us they will pay. I am more than willing to do this legally, but I have zero intentions of allowing them to walk away handing us chump-change. Their loss will be my life’s dedication to destroy them in every & any way possible. They want to drive someone crazy – GOOD – here I am and rapidly approaching the NO DEPOSIT – NO RETURN line. There is NOTHING they can do to me anymore. I am numb to their arrogance and to the supposed consequences for my actions.

    I have never been in trouble or broken the law – other than a ticket back in the 70s. Give me a damn McVeigh U-Hauler and I will light-up their world – THEN – maybe after several occurrences MAYBE they will see that all their freaking ill-gotten money doesn’t mean much if they are dead. Read about David Stern’s foreclosure mill in FL. That freaking guy’s 108 ft Yacht – Ferraris – etc… ALL by FORECLOSURE – 15-million dollar mansion – etc – WTF – we need to bring our boys home with their SNIPER RIFLES – that will take care of that problem real quick. Sound crazy – watch & see. Honestly, I hope it does not come to that but I do not see much of an alternative anymore. These foreclosure people are terrorists and the most VILE on the planet. They & their families must be treated equally so that FUTURE generations will always remember the consequences for betraying our trust.

  25. @angry & not taking it,

    Success is very much an option. btw, I have been on this site for almost 3 years now and had posted significantly before. I am not a newbie on this site.

    My case was much different than most here in that I took an offesive approach. I rescinded the loan 6 months b4 they filed suit. I had done a great deal of research during that period in time. It also helped that I am a paralegal with 20 years of civil trial litigation experience.

    I am sorry for being so vague but I really cannot go into the details. What I can tel you is that they filed a foreclosure action against me and I filed a federal action against them asserting TiLA, RESPA, FCRA, claims.

    I mailed out QWRs – 3 to be exact – none were responded to so I had a very good RESPA and FCRA claim. I also contacted the CRAs to dispute the servicer’s reporting. If you are within the extended 3 years statute of repose and you have mailed out a rescission letter, then file a TILA action against them. I understand that in the 9th Cir, there is the tender rule and you must plead tender. This is actually opposite of TILA. However, in those jurisdictions that require this, the only solution would be to take a case to the Supreme Court of the U.S.

    Same with the QWRs – do not wait for them to file against you. I slammed them with paperwork.

    I urge everyone to take an active offensive posture. Attack them before they attack you, Put them on the defensive and don’t back down.

    I also like Neil’s single transaction theory. This was one transaction from the creation of the trust to the loan signing. Many mistakes were made in the rush to get the loans securitized, The greed made for sloppiness.

    The majority of the notes are actually non-negotiable, allonges are invalid, etc. Examine the documents under a microscope. You will be surprised what you discover. Every time I took a look at the closing documents, I found something new that I had missed b4. The docs produced by the servicer, even though they were sorely lacking, held a wealth of info when compared to the docs received at closing.

    Disclaimer: I am not an attonrey and nothing herein should be construed as legal advice. Please consult with a knowledgable attorney in your jurisdiction.

  26. If any one wants to organize a protest, please advise. I am ready…I am mad as hell and will remain this way until I die.

  27. @Larry,
    Stop with the Biblical references…..OMG, if I start to hear that the reason we are going through all this trouble is because of 2012 or Satan, I might explode.

  28. to edgetrader plus all others- citing case law is critical, on the blog of MattWeidnerlawblog he is giving up free of charge ALL of his case cites as to capacity,standing, etc. I would imagine that if you filed your suit(s) with 100+ case cites that the judge would sit up and take notice. There was an earlier post today which reference a hearing during which the judge said (sic) ” well isn’t that how all these foreclosures? are filed? sorry, I logged on and off in about 3 minutes, and now it is gone from the comments file. But it is in there somewhere. What is THAT judge thinking about tonight? The atty representing the homeowner responded (sic) “,,, only if the homeowner contests it your honor”. Can someone tell us where that case site is?

  29. THIS is exactly why Obama should be driven from office. It is Obama who is purposely allowing this catastrophe to redistribute wealth. He has kept banks that should be dead and gone artificially alive like vampires using our tax dollars for blood so they can in turn remain undead and sweep across the country like a Biblical plague of Locusts devouring every bit of private property in their path and all this as a result of government’s theft and negligence in the first place. It is hard to remain non-violent in the light of such treachery. I wish someone would force feed Obama his failed loan mod program in suppository form!

  30. @ Angry and not taking it.
    Yep, gag orders. I have told all my close friends that in the end of this, I may never be able to tell them what happened…..I told them that if I end up taking them out for dinner with a big smile on my face, I won.

  31. Monday 9 August 2010

    While I can agree with the sentiment, it will not likely stand any chance of working because people are NOT united, nor are they prepared to deal with the consequences.

    A more effective tactic is to learn how to present a pleading that will stop the other side. Stop paying mortgage payments, but only if you are prepared to mount a credible defense that will stop the other side, and there are more and more case examples of how things are turning around. THAT is where progress will be made…in Court.

    Trust me, the other side, and that includes judges, are far more organized and formidable than the “people.”

    David makes an eloquent case for himself. A few aspects caught my attention.


    “The idiocy of attempting to work this out legally – respectfully is futile because they have NO INTENTION of working anything out. Their intentions are clear – pound us into poverty – take the property – sue us for whatever else defiency or whatever and leave us for dead…”

    Love the conclusion! It is also accurate. As to the first part, it may be difficult, but it can be done legally by FORCING the issue through strong pleadings, arguemts, and backed by case law. This is why sites like these are SO IMPORTANT. Here is where the “people” can be organized, learn what has worked, what has not, and use it to advantage.

    The numbers of increased challenges in the courts will back up the system to the choking point! It does not require mass demonstrations, and it does not require mass amounts of people pleading. Most foreclosures go unopposed or opposed by an incompetent “pro se” making emotional, not legal pleas, hoping for “jutice.” If just 10% or 15% of cases were strongly challenged with information garnered from here and elsewhere, what an impact it would have!!!


    “Yet, at no-time did we participate with their lies & deception.”

    Not intentionally, and certainly not knowingly, but anyone who signed for a note did participate. Lies and deception? That is how one makes challenges in pleadings, exposing the lies, deception and fraud.

    Forget about Patrick. He ain’t gonna change, and anyone wanting to do battle with him is just wasting energy, so consider the source and move on, on that one.

    You present yourself well, David, and I am not challenging you, [beyond the few observations made],
    nor do I know the specifics of your situation. I am in the foreclosure fray myself, but by choice, so I know how dirty the debt collectors are, [I do not call them attorneys], and I know how dirty most of the judges are,
    from first-hand experience.

    What I also know from first-hand experience is that the only way I have lasted for 3 1/2 years in court is because I refused to give in, and I am back in court tomorrow.

    Kind regards to you…

  32. Alina
    “sorry, can’t divulge any more secrets – confidentiality agreement.”
    do tell.. you’ve been posing here for a long time, so if a “confidentiality agreement” has been made , who are the parties & this was successful, when or at what point in the case was the success achieved .?
    you do understand if a win of this nature has occurred but no mention of this was divulged , the suspicion of this very tactic “gag order or whatever” has been expressed before but no one has ever verified this “silenced win”. Not sure i understand the[or your] reluctance to inform us that the success “is possible”.

  33. I’m already there, I never paid the new guy. Asked for proof they would not give it and threatened to foreclose if I didn’t pay. Was RICO, tough guy pops up claiming a debt with no proof, fabricates standing in the public. We know the story. Leave no money in the bank,and if you withdraw ask for it in coins. Let them order it if they have to, but no more paper money…no more.

    I had a right to know, and a right to say ‘no’. I said ‘no’.
    Their world requires paper to move everyday. That’s why when they aren’t lending, there is no paper moving and things grind to a halt, so to keep that from happening, they pump paper into the system.

    I’m not stashing anything. I’m going to live day to day.
    They orchestrated the Great Depression, and this is another orchestrated event. I hope ‘commerce’ grinds to a halt. I’m making that a thought for my every day move. Let the sun do a CME event, their computers shut down, and there be no commerce.

    Like “The Day the Earth Stood Still” think it, believe it, want it.
    When we drop the old ways, we’ll come up with a new way to do things.

    I strategic defaulted, and if I had a good contract and they people demanding money were a legitimate business, I’d still be a homeowner and paying my bills.

    “They drew first blood.” Quoting Sylvester Stallone in the movie “First Blood”

    I know nothing and if I think I know something, we can easily prove I know nothing. I don’t give legal advice because I don’t know legal things.

    Light and Love
    Trespass Unwanted, sui juris in propria persona

  34. Oh, I like the suggestion of picketing at the courthouse steps when they are holding the auctions. Call in the media and let them know beforehand. That one I think I can arrange in Seattle. Happens every Friday. Come on Washingtonians……call me. 206-396-4486


  35. I agree–stop paying. If you feel guilty about it, remember that you weren’t lent any money at all; or rather, you exchanged a promissory note in exchange for credits to an account in your name, which is even Steven in my book.

    The payments are the only thing that keep these parasites alive. That’s why they’re working so hard to make the little guy feel guilty.

  36. One item that we can borrow from MADD is to sit in the courtrooms, take notes, and post the findings online. MADD has been extremely successful by these tactics in gettng higher conviction rates on DUIs. I have heard from some posters that in Florida, they are not being allowed in the courtrooms because of a “security risk.” This is against our consititutional rights – in this country we have an open courts system. I am in the process of researching this issue and will post my findings.

    Also, MADD is politically active at election times – any judge they perceive as being lenient is sure to raise their ire. Judges and the courts need to be made aware that they are in the public’s eye.

    We will no longer allow judges to simply stamp “Granted” on the foreclosing entities’ motions for summary judgment. If need be, picketing in front of the courthouses are in order. Foreclosing entities MUST prove they have standing and the capacity to sue. These cases are not simple “foreclosures” but complex litigation cases and must be given that status.

    as A MAN says: NEVER AGAIN!!!!

  37. we need to recall a politicians that is all. NO VIOLENCE NEEDED THAT IS WHY I SAY CITY COUNSEL MEETINGS






  39. David,

    I can so relate to your anger. I spent month after month calling to see if we qualified for a modification and month after month, there was a new and different lie. Finally, you receive the news you have been waiting for – woo hoo – you qualify for a trial modification period. You are told that if you make three mortgages payments on time, then your loan will be modified on the fourth month.

    Along comes the fourth month – you’ve made the payments on time, so what is there to worry about, right? Wrong – now you are told that there is x-amount lump sum that must be paid before you can get a permanent modification.

    It was at this point that I decided to utilize my research skills. I researched the loan originator – they went belly up the year before. However, there is a federal complaint – download a copy from PACER and, lo and behold, as you read it, you can identify with the borrower – it’s your story.

    Then comes researching all the consumer protection statutes – TILA, RESPA, etc. You scour through your loan documents and realize there are a myriad of violations. At the same time, you realize that the extended 3 year statute of repose is about to expire. You know the statute, you reearched case law, scoured the internet, and so you prepare a rescission letter.

    Guess what, no answer. Shouldn’t be a surprise. In the meantime, the servicer keeps calling you and you keep trying to explain to the brain dead person on the other end that you have rescinded the mortgage. But somehow, they keep think you said “resent” instead of “rescind.” So you try to explain the difference to the bonehead and you can literally hear the wind blowing between their ears. Finally, after about the 10th time, you tell them to cease and desist. You also tell them to notify their legal department because they are about to go on a wild ride.

    While you are busy putting together a lawsuit against the bozos, they turn around and file a foreclosure action against you. You file a motion to dismiss, calll the clerk’s office to schedule and are told that you have to coordinate the hearing with opposing counsel. Oh, and by the way,since this is simply a “foreclosure,” the judge only hears motions on Friday mornings. Opposing counsel decides that they will not agree to set a hearing date. Finally, after 6 months, you get your hearing date and go to court armed with all your research, case law, documents, etc. Opposing counsel doesn’t show up. The judge wants to reset. You are able to convince the judge to hear your motion so the judge orders his clerk to call opposing counsel. Opposing counsel just happens to still be in his office so the hearing goes forward. Then the judge denies your motion and tells you that because you have federal claims, you need to file a federal lawsuit – no joke, you’ve had that baby ready to go for a year now. So you file your federal claim and it’s just the beginning of another merry-go-round.

    I will not further bore you all with the rest of this story…suffice to say that it does end on the good side. sorry, can’t divulge any more secrets – confidentiality agreement.

  40. To do this every one need to be at the same point.”UNITED WE STAND” then and only then things will change. We have to help each other,. Do not expect any thing from “SELECTED” and “ELECTED” people.

    Thanks and Be Safe

  41. BSE – You are right. The only way to do is stop making the payments and take the money out of the bank accounts,
    With no money there is nothing to leverage, therefore no financial instruments to sell. No violence, no nothing. Just pure clean action

  42. We need to stop these bastards, Be a patriot. Stop your payment. It is they only way to take action and battle with protest.

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